Independent Live! 'In a democracy, changes are made by us'
The latest debate was a fiery affair that covered topics from the crisis in politics to climate change
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"Is politics in crisis?" was the focus of last night's third Independent Live! event, which took place in Brighton. The debate, chaired by The Independent's chief political commentator Steve Richards, also saw panellists Johann Hari, Yasmin Alibhai-Brown, Simon Fanshawe and former Conservative MP Michael Brown discuss topics including the use of secret evidence and global warming.
The panellists were grilled by an audience of Independent readers in the town's Royal Pavilion in a sometimes heated debate. Award-winning columnist Hari called for a change in the perception of what politics is. "Government does not happen up there," he told the packed room, pointing in the vague direction of Westminster, "but among us."
Calling for action on climate change, which he claimed is already having devastating effects across the world, Hari said: "A mass movement of citizens can affect climate change. People ask why the politicians are not changing things but in a democracy the changes are up to us to make."
Paul Duncan, an audience member, asked if 16-year-olds, allowed to sign up to the armed forces, should also be allowed to vote. The panel was largely in favour and Michael Brown caught the mood saying that a full package of voting reforms should be considered, including a fully elected House of Lords.
Broadcaster Simon Fanshawe also reminded the audience that servicemen are not allowed to serve in combat until they reach 18-years-old and added that: "There is a huge value of young people going into uniformed service."
However as the debate heated up Johann Hari made the point that young men and women joining up at 16 could be forced to serve at a later date. His question, "Is that right?" drew a swift response from Fanshawe. "No," he said.
Another audience member raised the issue of two Pakistani students who she said are being held in custody but have not been told why. In response Yasmin Alibhai-Brown launched into an impassioned defence of the fundamental principles on which she said British society is built. She claimed that a number of the former detainees had accepted deportation and were now back in their home country, having been forced to abandon their studies. "It is like Guantanamo," she said. "People are banged up without charge but are presumed to be dangerous.
"People are beginning to see that the problem is not simply us troublesome Muslims but society as a whole. Not telling people what they are charged with should not be happening in a democracy." Alibhai-Brown also accused the government of being "naturally authoritarian".
Amid calls for a return to ideology in politics, Michael Brown drew loud applause when he said he felt the electorate did not really know what Tory leader David Cameron's policies were.
Replying to a question from the audience claiming that politics has become less entrenched, Michael Brown said that there used to be a party which offered policies that appealed to its hardcore supporters. Now, he said: "I do not believe that people really know what David Cameron's policy on poverty is."
He also predicted trouble for the Tory leader on the issue of Europe, saying that Cameron had: "Kicked the issue of the Lisbon Treaty in long grass."
He added that the party leader would face difficulties from the back benches "when things are not going so well".
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Comments
That's the theory but in practice we have little to say on public policy in the long periods between elections. As citizens and electorate in Britain, we need better instruments, "tools" of democracy. Here's how to get them:
BACKGROUND
A general election for Britain and Northern Ireland will almost certainly take place in 2010. The three large political parties are NOT clearly committed to introduce elements of genuine citizen-led democracy. The conservatives have talked of "election primaries" and petitions to Parliament. Gordon Brown praises "citizens' juries", an apology for effective democratic innovation. The LibDems at their conference rejected a proposal for genuine direct democracy.
To achieve STATE OF THE ART democracy we must introduce PARTIAL DIRECT DEMOCRACY. The three main elements which we at I&R ~ GB propose are:
1) The Initiative. A proposal which has been endorsed by an agreed (large) number of voters must within reasonable time be debated in Parliament. If Parliament rejects or fails to address the proposal then a plebiscite ("referendum") must be held.
2) The Veto Referendum. A law or ruling made by Parliament or government must be put to referendum if a large number of voters demand this.
Once we have "1)" we can push through further reforms such as
3) The Recall. Members of parliament may be dismissed in the period between elections. An agreed large number of electors from the MP's constituency may demand that a ballot be held to decide whether the MP should be dismissed. A dismissed MP would be disqualified from a resulting by-election.
----------------------------------------
UK DIRECT DEMOCRACY ELECTION-CAMPAIGN
As campaigners for and supporters of "citizens' initiative and referendum" we must begin to put pressure on candidates, sitting MPs and parties in their headquarters. Please help, and play your part -- see the following:
WHAT YOU CAN DO
The I&R ~ GB (direct democracy) election strategy is ready.
Please read the pages "Frame one", "Frame two" and the short "Statement on UK democracy ...."
If you agree with the plan-of-action then why not join in? It will not take much time, there are no extra costs and if enough people join in we will make a big impact.
Here are the documents with urls (hyperlinks):
START http://www.iniref.org/carta.htm
OPEN ELECTION-CAMPAIGN STRATEGY
FRAME ONE
Setting the scene http://www.iniref.org/tactic.html
OPEN ELECTION-CAMPAIGN STRATEGY
FRAME TWO
The election-campaign plan-of-action http://www.iniref.org/tactic2.html
INDEX PAGE AND PROMISE
STATEMENT ON UK DEMOCRACY BY MEMBERS AND PROSPECTIVE MEMBERS OF PARLIAMENT
http://www.iniref.org/carta.htm
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Contact:
I&R ~ GB
info AT iniref.org
We would like to have your feed-back.
Send us your comments and suggestions for improvement.
How can we help the direct democracy campaign to succeed?
GETTING REAL DEBATE DD:GB Proposals for the introduction of Elements of Direct Democracy in Great Britain and Northern IrelandWe present four sets of proposals originating from four different groups: Unlock Democracy, the Power Inquiry, Our Say and I&R~GB Campaign for Citizens’ Initiative and Referendum. Read the comments of experts from eastern and western Europe, Canada and the USA and add your own reply.
http://www.iniref.org/latest.html
Methods of democracy similar to those which we propose have been in use for decades in Italy and Switzerland, more recently in ALL Lands of the German Federal Republic.
I&R ~ GB