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Gay marriage ban hangs in the balance

Rights groups warn of angry protests if California legal ruling goes against them

By Guy Adams in Los Angeles

Married same-sex couples prepare to retake their vows during a gay rights rally against Proposition Eight

AFP/GETTY IMAGES

Married same-sex couples prepare to retake their vows during a gay rights rally against Proposition Eight

Five years, thousands of weddings, dozens of lawsuits, and one tense referendum after gay couples were first allowed to tie the knot in California, the state's Supreme Court is poised to once more decide their future.

A panel of seven judges will announce tomorrow whether Proposition Eight, a same-sex marriage ban approved by a narrow majority of voters in November, should now be tossed out because of claims that it was put to the ballot improperly. The court, which has been considering the matter since March, will also reveal the fate of 18,000 couples who married in a five-month period last year when same-sex weddings were allowed. They have been in legal limbo since.

Most experts expect existing marriages to be upheld, but say the court is unlikely to contravene the democratically expressed wish of a slim majority of Californians by overturning Proposition Eight, which was approved by 52 per cent of voters.

Whatever the verdict, a string of demonstrations is already scheduled tomorrow. If the ban is upheld, organisers of at least one event, at San Francisco's City Hall, say large numbers of attendees plan to be "arrested in civil disobedience".

Gay marriage rivals abortion and gun control among America's most divisive social issues, pitting well-funded lobby groups on the religious Right, who claim it undermines traditional family values, against equally trenchant proponents on the liberal Left.

The issue has prompted angry protests and widespread consumer boycotts. Last month, it even overshadowed the Miss USA pageant, when the runner-up, California's Carrie Prejean, was subjected to a vicious smear campaign after voicing opposition to same-sex unions.

Since Proposition Eight passed, four states – Iowa, Vermont, Maine and Connecticut – have legalised the practice, joining Massachusetts, where it has been legal for several years. Another such law is pending in New Hampshire.

But California, as America's most populous state, is seen as the nation's most important "bellwether". Despite the traditionally liberal leanings of Californians, the state is evenly balanced on the issue, thanks to its large Hispanic population which takes a Catholic view on social issues.

Awaiting the outcome of the challenge to Proposition Eight has been an "an absolutely gut-wrenching experience", Molly McKay, of Marriage Equality USA, told the Associated Press. "As Californians, we are all under tremendous strain worrying about the economy, our jobs and our families," she said. "Gay families have been living for months with the fear that the court will allow a bare majority of voters to strip gay and lesbian families of their constitutional protections."

This turbulent saga began in 2004, when the Mayor of San Francisco, Gavin Newsom, unilaterally decided to begin issuing marriage licences to gay couples in the city. Local courts soon intervened, ruling that Mr Newsom had overstepped his authority. But last May, the State Supreme Court upheld an appeal, deciding that California's constitution provides a "fundamental" right to marry that should extend to all couples, regardless of their orientation.

Thousands of couples were married between May and November last year but new weddings were halted after election day, when Proposition Eight narrowly passed after an $80m (£55m) battle that made it the most expensive ballot measure on a social issue in US history.

The appeal being decided tomorrow revolves around a legal technicality: supporters of gay marriage claim that Proposition Eight changed the state's constitution, and therefore should not have been put to the public vote until it had been approved by two-thirds of the state's lawmakers.

The State's attorney general, Jerry Brown, agreed in March that they have a case under Californian law. But most of those close to the issue do not expect the Supreme Court to look particularly favourably upon it. "The court is very, very reluctant to frustrate the will of the people as demonstrated by their vote," said Gerald Uelman, a law professor and expert on the State Supreme Court. "If they agree [the right to same-sex marriage] is so fundamental that to abolish it revises the constitution, they would have to admit they revised the constitution in the first place."

In the likely event that the court upholds the ban, proponents of gay marriage will try to have it overturned by democratic means, with a fresh ballot measure in either 2010 or 2012. Like voters across the rest of the country, a small majority of Californians remain opposed to gay marriage. But polling data indicates that public attitudes are softening.

Opponents have been the target of fierce protests after November's vote. Tomorrow's ruling may arouse renewed anger, but Protect Marriage, the leading group behind the ban, says it is "looking forward" to the decision. "The wait is finally over," read a statement from its general counsel Andrew Pugno. "We're confident that the right of the people to protect traditional marriage in the state Constitution will ultimately prevail."

Timeline: The battle over same-sex marriages in California

February 2004: Gavin Newsom, Mayor of San Francisco, issues an edict allowing gay marriage. But Arnold Schwarzenegger, California's Republican Governor, faces calls from his party to intervene.

March 2004: The state Supreme Court tells San Francisco to halt same-sex weddings, pending a hearing.

August 2004: Nearly 4,000 gay marriages performed earlier in the year in San Francisco are annulled.

September 2005: Governor Schwarzenegger vetoes a bill making California the first US legislature to approve same-sex marriages.

May 2008: The Supreme Court overturns the ban, deciding it is discriminatory.

November 2008: Opponents of gay marriage win the campaign to ban it, known as Proposition 8, with 52 per cent of votes in referendum.

March 2009: Opposition groups file a request for Supreme Court to block the measure, arguing it is unconstitutional. The decision is due on Tuesday.

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Comments

Is Gay Marriage a contradiction in terms?
[info]collin_brown wrote:
Monday, 25 May 2009 at 12:09 am (UTC)
Re: Is Gay Marriage a contradiction in terms?
[info]mike_spain wrote:
Monday, 25 May 2009 at 10:50 am (UTC)
Most people would say it is a contradiction in terms as the marriage of male and female is a core value intrinsic in all religions that I know of. It has been the bedrock of keeping a family together, providing food & shelter and procreating future generations. Additionally in most religions homo-sexuality is either frowned upon, forbidden and in many Muslim countries is punishable by death. That said, most of us have no problem with same sex partnerships which have the same legal rights as heterosexual couples in areas such as pensions provisioning and even the divorce courts if they fail. It seems to me that unfortunately a few gay activists rather than campaigning just for equal rights (which they now have) they want to take it further and force others to promote same sex relationships such as marriage as the norm or even superior to heterosexual marriage. Problem is that evolution is based on two different sex's in all mammals and without that norm the human race would become extinct.
Re: Is Gay Marriage a contradiction in terms? - [info]collin_brown - Monday, 25 May 2009 at 11:46 am (UTC) Expand
It's time.
[info]cornetmustich wrote:
Monday, 25 May 2009 at 12:10 am (UTC)
Grow up America. It's time for marriage equality.

Kudos to New England, Iowa and DC.

Cheers, Joe Mustich, Justice of the Peace
Washington, Connecticut USA

http://justicesofthepeace.blogspot.com

what do you mean "vicious smear campaign"
[info]innuendouk wrote:
Monday, 25 May 2009 at 01:45 am (UTC)
Guy - no one subjected Carrie Prejean to a vicious smear campaign. She did herself in by making clear her hypocrisy, stupidity and rank self-rightousness. It is not a smear campaign to scratch a little beneath the surface to find what lives the opponents of same gender marriage lead. In the case of this woman, she was ready to pontificate and damn gay people while have plenty of skeletons in her own closet. And do it always goes!
'Civil Partnerships' or 'Marriage'?
[info]sjkillman wrote:
Monday, 25 May 2009 at 02:42 am (UTC)
The issue should be whether 'civil partnerships' are sanctioned by law, not 'marriage'. The controversy could have been avoided if the law allowed anybody to name one significant other to have the financial and care rights currently given to a married couple. This way sibblings that live together in the same house, carers of parents, same sex couples etc could have the same legal protection. 'Marriage' is a term used for heterosexual couples who produce their own biological children and their children get the same legal protection. Religeous sanctions are a matter for Faith leaders, not legal issues.
Re: 'Civil Partnerships' or 'Marriage'?
[info]graeme_archer wrote:
Monday, 25 May 2009 at 07:02 am (UTC)
"'Marriage' is a term used for heterosexual couples who produce their own biological children" --

interesting news for any Male-Female couples out there without children. Oh but I forget, you have a hierarchy of marriage in Religious World, don't you? With Males and Females with loads of kids at the top, childless heterosexuals beneath, and homosexual couples right at the bottom. Such is the indivisibility of love in Religious World! And perhaps you could remind me when the word 'marriage' became owned by religious people?
Re: 'Civil Partnerships' or 'Marriage'? - [info]sjkillman - Monday, 25 May 2009 at 12:19 pm (UTC) Expand
Re: 'Civil Partnerships' or 'Marriage'? - [info]mike_spain - Monday, 25 May 2009 at 12:23 pm (UTC) Expand
Re: 'Civil Partnerships' or 'Marriage'? - [info]sjkillman - Monday, 25 May 2009 at 02:30 pm (UTC) Expand
Re: 'Civil Partnerships' or 'Marriage'?
[info]colinru wrote:
Monday, 25 May 2009 at 02:23 pm (UTC)
Well said. I agree, mostly.
see what liberalism does...
[info]sportingmac wrote:
Monday, 25 May 2009 at 07:25 am (UTC)
..takes a perfectly good idea and corrupts it.
Vicious Smear Campaign?
[info]cs2002 wrote:
Monday, 25 May 2009 at 07:36 am (UTC)
Seriously, the article is fine, but the Carrie Prejean soap opera would have remained a dumb soap opera between two dolts: Prejean and Perez Hilton, if it were not for right-wing churches and right wing television networks rushing to her side and propping her up as the latest hero of the religulous right, picking up the mantle left behind by Joe "The Plumber". And Prejean herself decided to use her 15 minutes of fame to further her anti-gay message. So whatever so-called "smear campaign" that happened was brought on by her and the people who decided that gay marriage is such an important issue that they were willing to make a lying, responsibility abdicating, boobs-altering bikini-clad beauty pageant contestant the poster girl for morality.
GAY MARRIAGE ..... WHO CARES?
[info]georgesign wrote:
Monday, 25 May 2009 at 08:24 am (UTC)
I can't see the problem. If it's for legal reason such as inheritance then everyone should be allowed to "marry" who they like ...... brothers, sisters aunties, uncles, dogs and rabbits. Many people think more of their dogs than people so why shouldn't they "marry" their dog.
Re: GAY MARRIAGE ..... WHO CARES?
[info]m_a_s_p_r wrote:
Monday, 25 May 2009 at 09:29 am (UTC)
"So why shouldn't they "marry" their dog."

Informed consent from all parties.
PUT THE GAYS IN HOSPITAL WHERE THEY BELLONG!
[info]copycat7 wrote:
Monday, 25 May 2009 at 08:57 am (UTC)
GAY IS A MENTAL ILLNESS AND SHOULD BE TREATED AS SUCH!. MANIPULATIVE PERSONALITY, NO INHIBITIONS, SPITEFULL BEHAVIOR TO ALL WHO SPEAK AGAINST THERE BEHAVIOR, OBBSESSION WITH SEX, GENERAL IMATURITY, IN NEED OF ATTENTION DRAMA QUEENS, EXAGERATORS, PERSECUTION COMPLEX PARANOIA, SHALLOW MATERIALISTIC SHOPPING HABBITS, WIMPISH BEHAVIOR, ETC ETC...WELL ITS NOT THE AVERAGE STRAIT PERSON IM TALKING ABOUT NOW IS IT!.

GAYS DISGUSTS ME BECAUSE OF HOW MOST OF THEM BEHAVE NOT BECAUSE OF THE LABEL GAY!. THE STEREOTYPE DID NOT COME FROM NOWHERE!
Re: PUT THE GAYS IN HOSPITAL WHERE THEY BELLONG!
[info]cs2002 wrote:
Monday, 25 May 2009 at 09:15 am (UTC)
You're showing your stupidity.
Re: PUT THE GAYS IN HOSPITAL WHERE THEY BELLONG! - [info]dtolley2 - Monday, 25 May 2009 at 09:27 am (UTC) Expand
Re: PUT THE GAYS IN HOSPITAL WHERE THEY BELLONG! - [info]adampooler - Monday, 25 May 2009 at 10:10 am (UTC) Expand
Re: PUT THE GAYS IN HOSPITAL WHERE THEY BELLONG! - [info]richardm30 - Monday, 25 May 2009 at 12:50 pm (UTC) Expand
Re: PUT THE GAYS IN HOSPITAL WHERE THEY BELLONG! - [info]copycat7 - Monday, 25 May 2009 at 08:34 pm (UTC) Expand
Re: PUT THE GAYS IN HOSPITAL WHERE THEY BELLONG! - [info]collin_brown - Monday, 25 May 2009 at 01:10 pm (UTC) Expand
Re: PUT THE GAYS IN HOSPITAL WHERE THEY BELLONG! - [info]basteh416 - Monday, 25 May 2009 at 02:12 pm (UTC) Expand
Re: PUT THE GAYS IN HOSPITAL WHERE THEY BELLONG! - [info]colinru - Monday, 25 May 2009 at 02:13 pm (UTC) Expand
Re: PUT THE GAYS IN HOSPITAL WHERE THEY BELLONG! - [info]copycat7 - Monday, 25 May 2009 at 08:30 pm (UTC) Expand
Copycatis hate crime
[info]gaius_godd wrote:
Monday, 25 May 2009 at 09:29 am (UTC)
Copycat is committing a hate crime by voicing his vicious homophobia. His badly spelled posting should be removed by the moderator,
Re: Copycatis hate crime
[info]iskandar64 wrote:
Monday, 25 May 2009 at 09:51 am (UTC)
I think his comments should be left in - he demonstrates the marginality of his argument by they way he choses to represent it - I could visualise spittle flecked keyboard as I read it. As a gay man I think it does me a service.
Re: Copycatis hate crime - [info]zahradelaplata - Monday, 25 May 2009 at 12:34 pm (UTC) Expand
Re: Copycatis hate crime - [info]marginal_1 - Monday, 25 May 2009 at 01:04 pm (UTC) Expand
Re: Copycatis hate crime - [info]colinru - Monday, 25 May 2009 at 02:09 pm (UTC) Expand
Re: Copycatis hate crime - [info]dtnorth - Monday, 25 May 2009 at 09:54 am (UTC) Expand
Re: Copycatis hate crime - [info]colinru - Monday, 25 May 2009 at 02:21 pm (UTC) Expand
Re: Copycatis hate crime - [info]poges - Monday, 25 May 2009 at 02:56 pm (UTC) Expand
Re: Copycatis hate crime - [info]corporeal4now - Monday, 25 May 2009 at 07:34 pm (UTC) Expand
Re: Copycatis hate crime - [info]copycat7 - Monday, 25 May 2009 at 08:25 pm (UTC) Expand
This is hardly a minority group requiring a marry option
[info]tuskerdeman wrote:
Monday, 25 May 2009 at 11:20 am (UTC)
Two thirds of the global population are believed to be gay or bisexual. Yet nine tenths of the same group live as heterosexuals. Review Proposition 8 and hold another referendum? Take it through the judicial cycle once again. Its all a distraction!

Of course same sex marriages should be allowed, no argument. Marriage, after all, is merely a promise of bonded trust between two people. All else is glitz n bling.

Even now this smokescreen issue hides even more serious and devious practices within Westminster. Theses issues of public concern promoting furore, debate and distraction hides what is truly happening, by quietly invoking into law, further "legal" abuses to our personal private data whilst our backs are turned.

Big issue, very important, read here:
http://www.guardian.co.uk/politics/2009/may/24/jacqui-smith-dna-profile-database

Beyond financial charades, corporate abuses, ministers expenses and many other issues that have become public knowledge in recent times, "the people" are denied proper and open debate on our basic freedoms.

We must stop this.

The Executive Branch of Westminster must warrant the closest scrutiny and investigation on all of the events of recent times immediately.

Write to your MPs, form action groups, contact anyone that may assist in putting a stop to this crime against the people.
Re: This is hardly a minority group requiring a marry option
[info]collin_brown wrote:
Monday, 25 May 2009 at 01:15 pm (UTC)
2/3's of the worlds population are Gay? You lost any argument with that opener. Talk about give away your agenda.
Carrie Prejean
[info]dennis100 wrote:
Monday, 25 May 2009 at 01:11 pm (UTC)
It is a case of gross hypocrisy from the human rights brigade.

The human rights mantra is that these rights are ones that we possess by virtue of being human. That is why they go into bat for the most unsavoury of characters.

Yet, express a view that they don't like, and they will set out to try to utterly destroy that person. Privacy? An opponent of their views is unfit for such. Dignity? Their opponents are deserved of being dragged through the mud.

If you took their justifications seriously - "the girl expressed anti-gay views, let us see if she is so moral..." - then no one can engage in any debate unless morally pure. Debate is conducted only by the utterly righteous, or at least those whose skeletons are well-hidden, or it is about character assassination.

Lets face it. She expressed a view when asked, and got villified for it. Those who agreed with her raced to her defence. She fell in with them. No reason for character assassination.

And if she is bad for having breast implants, then let us here the progressives explain why that is an immoral thing? Or do they not believe in choice now? I think it a frivolous waste of money, but to decide on that basis that someone is not worth listening to? Again, so much for human rights not being things we can lose.

The left believes in human rights much as Torquemada believe in forgiveness - that is, fairlystrongly, until faced with someone who disagrees.
Re: Carrie Prejean
[info]colinru wrote:
Monday, 25 May 2009 at 02:29 pm (UTC)
Well said, Sir!
Re: Carrie Prejean - [info]cs2002 - Monday, 25 May 2009 at 03:41 pm (UTC) Expand
PROPOSITION EIGHT WAS A PYRRHUS VICORY
[info]e_paul_imhof wrote:
Monday, 25 May 2009 at 01:13 pm (UTC)
Illconceived but stunningly executed proposition 8 put some 18,000 same-sex marriages, performed in California the 5 months preceding last November's general elections into legal limbo, but won an unprecedented alliance of Fundamentalict, conservatave Catholics and Mormons dubious victory. Strong emotional backlash advances the gay/lesbian cause predictably nationwide faster than it would be otherwise possible.
Same-sex marriage may gain momentum regardless of tomorrow's California court rulings. tomorrow. Ironically opponents ignore that their efforts are counterproductive.
Why are these gays fighting for marriage anyway
[info]jonny123456 wrote:
Monday, 25 May 2009 at 01:26 pm (UTC)
Coming to think of it. Why are these guys so insistent on having the right to marry. Why can they not be happy with civil unions or some other recognition. I think the main incentive is that they would like to cash into the marriage scam! Many men have lost wealth through this arrangement to predatory women. Well some smart men would like part of the action too! There is also the possibility of getting citizenship. Isn't marriage worth fighting for?
Re: Why are these gays fighting for marriage anyway
[info]uanime5 wrote:
Monday, 25 May 2009 at 06:28 pm (UTC)
Does this mean that a man can have a civil partnership with a woman and not lose all his money in a divorce? If so tell me more.
it's wrong wrong wrong
[info]joshuacohen2003 wrote:
Monday, 25 May 2009 at 02:02 pm (UTC)
Gays are just wrong in every sense of normal rational behaviour.
forget the religious aspect because that's plain and simple and clearly obvious. No religion on earth condones homosexuality.

However lets look at it from an atheistic, scientific, logical, rational point of view. It's still glarignly obvious to anyone with a few brain cells that being homosexual is just idiotic nonsense. nature created males and females.

end of argument.
Re: it's wrong wrong wrong
[info]colinru wrote:
Monday, 25 May 2009 at 02:35 pm (UTC)
Still leaves the point that some men are born with brain differences that seem to make them homosexual. Who would rationally choose to be abnormal and cause themselves the problems that this can bring? They are what they are and should not be punished for it as long as they behave reasonably in public. We are almost all abnormal in some physical or mental way but we hope that we will, at least, be tolerated and, hopefully, accepted despite our differences.
Re: it's wrong wrong wrong - [info]robertclondon - Monday, 25 May 2009 at 07:28 pm (UTC) Expand
Re: it's wrong wrong wrong - [info]copycat7 - Monday, 25 May 2009 at 08:35 pm (UTC) Expand
[info]mhunter86 wrote:
Monday, 25 May 2009 at 02:56 pm (UTC)
I'm really quite shocked by the comment from Gerald Uelman, a law professor and expert on the State Supreme Court. "If they agree [the right to same-sex marriage] is so fundamental that to abolish it revises the constitution, they would have to admit they revised the constitution in the first place." The court in IRMC ruled that the right of marriage was derived from Article 1, Section 1 of the CA Constitution. The court interprets what has been written. That isn't a revision, that is an interpretation of the existing document. How a law professor can state such tripe is astounding. He has been taking a spin class from Karl Rove.
I am happy to see that ll the anti-gay equality voices...
[info]steerpike66 wrote:
Monday, 25 May 2009 at 03:31 pm (UTC)
...on this message board are incapable of putting an apostrophe in the right place.

Oh, and religious is obscurantist twaddle, a half hour watching Derren Brown would convince a child that it's all rubbish and superstition.
Religious NutJobs
[info]mattvauxhall wrote:
Monday, 25 May 2009 at 04:29 pm (UTC)
Whats extraordinary is that Religious NutJobs casually expressing their hatred. Like its an excuse to say "its what i believe". Er some people believe in slavery, racism , probably even random killing but we dont listen to them....
I pray to the baby cheeses that these cretinous people and thir mind numbingly dumb superstitions Persist off
[info]wotnot wrote:
Monday, 25 May 2009 at 05:54 pm (UTC)
Separate church and state for heterosexuals, so that the secular law provides the protection, and the church provides the title of 'husband and wife', should one be interested in that packaging. Some religions do not have legally recognised 'marriages', so they go out and get their legal licence to marry to two (pardon the pun). Early Christianity did not advocate marriage, but abstinence as part of a mystical flight from the flesh. The accomodation of marriage, but the greater appreciation of abstinence, is a hot topic within early Christianity, and forms the basis of a strange interest in what other people are up to - particularly women.

I don't much want the state in my life, nor religion in the state. But equal protection under the law seems a basic right; more than the term 'marriage'.
Gay marriage
[info]bobbellinhell wrote:
Monday, 25 May 2009 at 07:35 pm (UTC)
I don't understand why on the one hand gay rights campaigners are so keen to have the word 'marriage', and on the other why the religious maniacs are so upset about marriage being extended to gay couples. It's not as if anyone will be forced to change their existing spouse for a same-sex one (unless I have grossly misunderstood what's being planned).

There are so many other issues to make mentalist message board posts about after all.
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