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Johann Hari: Accept the facts – and end this futile 'war on drugs'

We are handing one of our biggest industries over to armed, criminal gangs


EVA TATCHEVA

The proponents of the "war on drugs" are well-intentioned people who believe they are saving people from the nightmare of drug addiction and making the world safer. But this self-image has turned into a faith – and like all faiths, it can only be maintained by cultivating a deliberate blindness to the evidence.

The recent furore about the British government's decision to fire its chief scientific advisor on drugs, Professor David Nutt, missed the point. Yes, it is shocking that he was ditched for pointing out the mathematical truth that taking ecstasy is less dangerous than horse-riding, and that smoking cannabis is less harmful than drinking alcohol. But this is how the war on drugs has to be fought. The unofficial slogan of the prohibitionists for decades has been: The facts will only undermine the war, so invent some that show how successful we are, fast.

Look at the United States, the country that pioneered the drug war, and still uses its military and diplomatic might to demand the rest of the world cracks down. In 1998, the Office of National Drug Control Policy was ordered by Congress to stop funding any scientific research that might give the impression that we should redirect funding from anti-trafficking busts into medical treatment of addicts, or that there is any argument to legalise, regulate or medicalise drug use.

It's Nutt cubed: only tell us what we want to hear. So, to give a small example, the ONDCP spent $14bn on anti-cannabis adverts aimed at teenagers, and $43m to find out if the ads worked. They discovered that kids who saw the ads were more likely afterwards to get stoned, so the evidence was suppressed, and the ad campaign marched on.

What would happen if we started to build our drugs policy around the facts, rather than our desire for a fuzzy feeling inside? Prof Nutt only took baby steps in this direction before he was booted out. He argued that we should rank drugs by the harm they do, rather than by the size of the panicked headlines they trigger. Now the row is fading, it is possible to see how conservative he was. A must-read new report out this week – "After The War on Drugs: Blueprint for Regulation", by the Transform Drug Policy Foundation – follows the facts as far as they will take us. It shows that the rational solution is to take the drug market back from the unregulated anarchy of criminal gangs, and transfer it to pharmacists, off-licences, and doctors who operate in the legal economy. To see why this is necessary, we have to look at some of the facts our politicians refuse to see:

Fact One The drug war hands one of our biggest industries to armed criminal gangs, who unleash terrible violence across the country. When alcohol was prohibited in the US in the 1920s, it didn't vanish. No: armed gangsters like Al Capone stepped in and sold it – and they shot anybody who got in their way. Yet today, Wine Rack does not shoot up Threshers. Oddbins does not threaten to kill anybody who sees its staff selling wine. Why? Because it wasn't the booze that caused the violence; it was the prohibition. Once alcohol was reclaimed for legal businesses, the dealer-on-dealer violence swiftly stopped.

Where there is a huge profit to be made in a black market – it's 3,000 per cent on drugs today – people will fight and kill to control it. Arrest a dealer, and you simply trigger a new war for his patch, with the rest of us caught in the crossfire. In 1986, the Nobel-prize winning economist, Milton Friedman, calculated that there are 10,000 murders in the US alone every year caused this way. Legalise, and you bankrupt most organised crime overnight. With their profits in freefall, the gangsters don't suddenly become cuddly – but the huge financial incentives to remain a gangster wither fast. It's the drug war that keeps them in business, and legalisation that shuts them down. As Friedman said: "Prohibition is the drug dealer's best friend."

Fact Two Under prohibition, drug use becomes more hardcore. Before alcohol prohibition, most Americans drank beer and wine. After prohibition was introduced, super-strong moonshine became the most popular drink, as booze rapidly became 150 per cent stronger. Why?

The writer Richard Cowan called it "the iron law of prohibition": whenever you criminalise a substance, it gets stronger. Because they are smuggling and stashing a substance, the dealers condense their product to give the biggest possible kick while taking up the smallest possible space. It's at work today: it's why dealers invented crack in the 1980s. The researchers Matthew Robinson and Renee Scherlen found: "The increased deadly nature of drugs under prohibition led to 15,000 more deaths in 2000 [in the US alone] than [if] prohibition had not made drugs more dangerous."

Fact Three The drug war doesn't reduce drug use – but the alternatives can. Some people believe these two dark side-effects are a price worth paying if prohibition stops a significant number of people from picking up their first bong or needle. It was an understandable enough argument – until the evidence came in from countries that have experimented with ending the drug war.

On 1 July 2001, Portugal decriminalised the possession of all drugs, including heroin and cocaine. You can have and use as much as you like for your own needs, and if you are caught, the police might refer you to a rehab programme, but you will never get a criminal record. (Supplying and selling remains illegal.) The prohibitionists predicted a catastrophic rise in addiction, and even I – an instinctive legaliser – was nervous.

Now we know: overall drug use actually fell a little. As a major study by Glenn Greenwald for The Cato Institute found, among Portuguese teenagers the fall was fastest: 13-year-olds are four per cent less likely to use drugs, and 16-year-olds are six per cent less likely. As the iron law of prohibition predicts, the use of hard drugs has fallen fastest: heroin use has crashed by nearly 50 per cent among the young who were not yet addicted. The Portuguese have switched the billions that used to be spent chasing and jailing addicts to providing them with prescriptions and rehab. The number of people in drug treatment is now up by 147 per cent. Almost nobody in Portugal wants to go back. Indeed, many citizens want to take the next step: legalise supply too, and break the back of the gangs.

Portugal is no fluke. It turns out that wherever the drug laws are relaxed, drug use stays the same, or – where spending is switched to treatment – declines. Between 1972 and 1978, 11 US states decriminalised marijuana possession. The National Research Council found that the number of dope-smokers stayed the same. In Switzerland, a decade ago the government started providing legal centres where people could safely inject heroin – for free. Burglary rates fell by 60 per cent, and street homelessness ended. A study by The Lancet – one of the most respected medical journals in the world – found that the rate of people becoming new heroin addicts fell by 82 per cent. Why? Heroin addicts didn't need to recruit new addicts to sell to in order to feed their habit. The pyramid scheme of heroin addiction was broken.

So the drug war doesn't achieve its goal of reducing addiction. All it does achieve is horrific gang violence – and in some cases the cartels gut whole countries like Mexico and Afghanistan. It does unwittingly press people into using harder and more dangerous drugs. And it does waste tens of billions of dollars that could really reduce drug addiction, by spending it on treatment for addicts.

The prohibitionists are therefore left a contradiction between their message and the facts. They can either change their message, or try to suppress the facts. Last week, the British Government made its choice. But how long will this be tenable? The prohibitionists are – from the best intentions and the highest motives – unleashing a catastrophe. Human beings have been finding ways to get stoned or high since we lived in caves. In our attempt to end this natural impulse, we have created a problem worse than drug use itself.

There is another way. Imagine a country with no drug dealers killing to protect their patch or terrorising whole estates. Imagine a country where burglary fell by 60 per cent. Imagine a Britain where we spent all these billions treating addicts as ill people who need our help, not hunting them down as criminals who need punishment. We can be that country. We just have to come down from chasing the dragon of a drug-free world – and start looking soberly at the facts.

To support the campaign for drug regulation, you can join, volunteer for or donate to the Transform Drug Policy Foundation at www.tdpf.org.uk

Want to ask Johann Hari or other top Independent journalists a question? Click here.

You can follow Johann on Twitter at www.twitter.com/johannhari101 - j.hari@independent.co.uk

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Puritans
[info]emperorofcdn wrote:
Wednesday, 11 November 2009 at 12:56 am (UTC)
The drug war keeps various groups happy. Much of the justice system would vanish without this war. Parents of out-of-control kids feel that the war on drugs keeps their crazy kids safer. And lastly and the worst the Puritans, who founded the US and much of its culture, love railing against all vices. This leads to politicians pandering to the Puritans. To let the drug issue drop would be to appear to give up. So the next overdose would be used by Puritans to end any "Pro-drugs" politician's career.

If music is bad because it leads to dancing then thinking about legalizing drugs might cause heads to explode.

So if you want to end this stupid war you don't need to use logic to convince the politicians, who doubtfully would disagree at all. You need to figure out how to shut the Puritans down. One idea would be: go to church; lose your vote.

Re: Puritans
[info]ancientoneuk wrote:
Wednesday, 11 November 2009 at 03:39 am (UTC)
But we only see the edge of a very murky world, during and before Iran-Contra the US government (the biggest armed criminal gang I can think of) were trafficking heroin and using the sales from that to help finance their illegal adventures elsewhere.

And some people are thinking that the same is happening again because so many forces are being used to guard poppy fields and drug warlords, tons of product go through checkpoints unmolested, America is in dire need of hard cash right now and it would not be the first time...

One of the biggest enablers of any drug trade is simply corruption and it is there that we need to start, weed out the blind-eye turners and those on the take, create a new breed of untouchables and give them the remit to seek out and purge this land of the filth that is drugs, whether through reclassification and decriminalisation, taxation even, I am not a fan of legalising but we need to remove the criminal element totally from one end to the other.
Excellent!!!!!
[info]hidedsarecoming wrote:
Wednesday, 11 November 2009 at 04:53 am (UTC)
This article is spot on. One of the best I've read for a long long time. I have taken drugs for years, and I have known some of the 'bad' people involved. The whole drugs problem is created by illegality, from the buzz of a first timer smoking a joint to the profits to be made from selling a wee (or a big)bit. Take that away and what? Everyone will be stoned? Get real, people aren't that stupid.

The police will have more time and money to do their job, the Health Service will have more time to spend on the seriously ill and more money to educate, and the government will have another income from the tax.

I agree the results wouldn't be perfect, but it certainly would be a hell of a lot better than it is now.

This country deserves better.
When will they ever learn?
[info]dinerouk9 wrote:
Wednesday, 11 November 2009 at 06:41 am (UTC)
Many know this already, but you try telling the bone-head conservative-minded senators and MP's, who fear a backlash from the voters. Well, they're getting a backlash on binge drinking and the violence that ensues, so they have to think about it.
As a right winger I totally support Mr Hari this time ,a rare event.
[info]jeanshaw wrote:
Wednesday, 11 November 2009 at 06:49 am (UTC)
Drug policy as practiced by Lib/Lab/Con is self defeating , it has effectively handed it over to violent criminal elements who manage drug policy in the context of a very poorly funded welfare system for addicts and a police and legal system which really cannot cope. A few arrests are made and sometimes there is a high profile seizure of drugs but generally the police are not capable of managing the problem.
What is needed is for drugs to be made legal , for them to be imported legally ,for them to be sold across the counter in normal retail outlets, for the Government to tax them and to use the proceeds for the help of addicts.
Then to stop criminals you have a punitive system of life for anyone who continues to sell drugs illegally.
£Agree £Agree £Agree
[info]over325one wrote:
Wednesday, 11 November 2009 at 07:41 am (UTC)
If people want drugs let them have them and we stop promoting crime. Millions of us have never taken drugs or even had the wish to. We lead normal lives without even considering drugs. I do agree with shutting pubs at 11:30. The open all hours policy has created more misery but as usual Brown's lot never admit they are wrong and the public suffer.
[info]smokyfrog wrote:
Wednesday, 11 November 2009 at 07:47 am (UTC)
Glad to see the Independent finding its voice at last on this subject. When you were deeply confused over skunk, as if it was some new and terrifying invention, I started to wonder if some Daily Mail hack had poisoned your drinking water. Or damaged your spine.

It's just a shame that the two main political parties still cling to their stale dogma because they're too scared to accept responsibility for the harm their policies cause to individual lives and to society.

Sex, drugs, rock 'n' roll. You may not approve that I enjoy such primal things but get over it!!
Here comes the hysteria
[info]gen_eric_user wrote:
Wednesday, 11 November 2009 at 01:13 pm (UTC)
What a wonderful outlook you have.

Also, you seem to have forgotten to cite your references.
here come the druggies
[info]lee_ji_me wrote:
Wednesday, 11 November 2009 at 08:23 am (UTC)
I hate misguided articles like this...most of the people who agree with it will be drug users
I understand the argument about the gangs and the illegal trade but allowing drugs to be legal will never change this! If drugs are legalised then the trade will only go into a darker territory of supplying more and more and cheaper and cheaper. You cannot allow this floodgate to open because human nature is WEAK
a society has to set parametres and boundaries against the odds or else human nature will deteriorate to such a level that it would be even worse than now to live on a planet with so many weak and misguided individuals indulging in self destructive behaviour patterns and living with no sense of optimism about life because they are inherently selfish. Drug users are for the most part very selfish and self obsessed people.
Re: here come the druggies
[info]uanime5 wrote:
Wednesday, 11 November 2009 at 08:53 am (UTC)
Care to explain why illegally supplying cheap alcohol is not a problem in most European countries even though it's legal?
Re: here come the druggies - [info]lee_ji_me - Wednesday, 11 November 2009 at 09:27 am (UTC) Expand
Easy - [info]fastguyeddie - Wednesday, 11 November 2009 at 12:40 pm (UTC) Expand
Re: here come the druggies - [info]media_myths - Wednesday, 11 November 2009 at 08:57 am (UTC) Expand
Re: here come the druggies - [info]lee_ji_me - Wednesday, 11 November 2009 at 09:32 am (UTC) Expand
Re: here come the druggies - [info]media_myths - Wednesday, 11 November 2009 at 10:04 am (UTC) Expand
Re: here come the druggies - [info]fastguyeddie - Wednesday, 11 November 2009 at 01:24 pm (UTC) Expand
Re: here come the druggies - [info]media_myths - Wednesday, 11 November 2009 at 03:57 pm (UTC) Expand
Re: here come the druggies - [info]media_myths - Wednesday, 11 November 2009 at 04:00 pm (UTC) Expand
Re: here come the druggies - [info]feydel2 - Wednesday, 11 November 2009 at 09:00 am (UTC) Expand
Re: here come the druggies - [info]feydel2 - Wednesday, 11 November 2009 at 09:05 am (UTC) Expand
Re: here come the druggies - [info]t_f_u - Wednesday, 11 November 2009 at 09:16 am (UTC) Expand
Re: here come the druggies - [info]clarakandola - Wednesday, 11 November 2009 at 09:58 am (UTC) Expand
Re: here come the druggies - [info]odubtaig - Wednesday, 11 November 2009 at 11:50 am (UTC) Expand
Re: here come the druggies - [info]lee_ji_me - Wednesday, 11 November 2009 at 05:58 pm (UTC) Expand
I'm Not A Druggie - [info]mike4626 - Wednesday, 11 November 2009 at 11:05 am (UTC) Expand
Re: I&#39;m Not A Druggie - [info]lee_ji_me - Wednesday, 11 November 2009 at 06:04 pm (UTC) Expand
Re: here come the druggies - [info]kerahdah - Wednesday, 11 November 2009 at 12:36 pm (UTC) Expand
Re: here come the druggies - [info]thelzdking - Wednesday, 11 November 2009 at 12:56 pm (UTC) Expand
Re: here come the druggies - [info]ant_g01 - Wednesday, 11 November 2009 at 04:42 pm (UTC) Expand
Re: here come the druggies - [info]dimlocator44 - Wednesday, 11 November 2009 at 06:25 pm (UTC) Expand
Re: here come the druggies - [info]lee_ji_me - Wednesday, 11 November 2009 at 07:02 pm (UTC) Expand
not that simple... - [info]dimlocator44 - Wednesday, 11 November 2009 at 08:40 pm (UTC) Expand
Re: not that simple... - [info]lee_ji_me - Wednesday, 11 November 2009 at 09:13 pm (UTC) Expand
Re: not that simple... - [info]richard_hode - Wednesday, 11 November 2009 at 10:05 pm (UTC) Expand
Re: not that simple... - [info]lee_ji_me - Thursday, 12 November 2009 at 12:15 am (UTC) Expand
Re: not that simple... - [info]sergio_montes - Wednesday, 11 November 2009 at 11:39 pm (UTC) Expand
Re: not that simple... - [info]dimlocator44 - Sunday, 15 November 2009 at 01:45 pm (UTC) Expand
Re: not that simple... - [info]lee_ji_me - Sunday, 15 November 2009 at 01:48 pm (UTC) Expand
Re: not that simple... - [info]dimlocator44 - Tuesday, 17 November 2009 at 02:44 pm (UTC) Expand
Re: not that simple... - [info]lee_ji_me - Tuesday, 17 November 2009 at 06:58 pm (UTC) Expand
[info]theeditor74 wrote:
Wednesday, 11 November 2009 at 08:41 am (UTC)
Thank god for some good old fashioned common sense. I could not agree more! Let's hope/pray one day Britain can learn from Portugal's example.
Thank god for some good old fashioned common sense.
[info]theeditor74 wrote:
Wednesday, 11 November 2009 at 08:42 am (UTC)
I could not agree more! Let's hope/pray one day Britain can learn from Portugal's example.
it's not war, it's business
[info]clarakandola wrote:
Wednesday, 11 November 2009 at 08:59 am (UTC)
The fact is that, unfortunately, the origins of and on-going compulsion to prohibit certain drugs has little to do with saving the nation's soul/health/moral standing and a lot to do with commercial and political ambition.

From the prohibiton of marijuana in the US as a result of tobacoo and alcohol companies lobbying government to prioritise their (arguably more dangerous) products, to the recent agreement by Uribe to allow US military bases in Colombia to fight narco-terrorists and (more interestingly) left-wing guerillas (one wonders whether they have included one Hugo Chavez in this list), we repeatedly see 'drug prevention' used to mask other objectives. Dominic Streatfield's 'Cocaine - An Unauthorised Biography' provides a fairly comprehensive overview of that industry and provides food for thought as to society's relationship with narcotics over the last century.

In our own country, we are faced with a government in its dying days who dare not risk the further wrath of Murdoch or a disillusioned electorate by taking a chance on a new strategy that involves basing policy on scientific evidence, a tsunami of social side effects and economic reality for our beleagured nation. Without some seriously fresh thinking, however, it is likely we will slide further into a real-life episode of The Wire.
A walk on the wildside.
[info]kingofmumu wrote:
Wednesday, 11 November 2009 at 09:01 am (UTC)
Its not our polititians who decide on drug policies or anything else. (do you really believe, they have the intelligence?) Its the people who are amassing personal fortunes and power that make the rules. Recessions,depressions, wars and pandemics have been orchestrated throughout history.
Re: A walk on the wildside.
[info]zippo49 wrote:
Wednesday, 11 November 2009 at 09:56 am (UTC)
So, if I got the argument correctly, the suggestion is that the government (any government) should legalize the use and take control of the import/production and distribution of drugs, tax it and use the taxes to treat the users??Hello!!! It's been tried and failed!!
Has anyone heard of the monopoly alcohol selling system in the Scandinavian countries? If not ,I strongly suggest that they do a research.
In brief, despite the controls and the large sums of money going to rehab and treatment of addicts, they have the highest alcohol abuse-related accidents, crime and deaths.
The various liberalization schemes they have tried from time to time with soft alcohol (beer and wine) has simply led to increased use among the younger.
Now, imagine a similar situation where drugs of all sorts are on offer!!
Or the idea is that the "industry" will be privatized? A much worse scenario!
The simple idea that all is allowed and is on offer will increase the use of drugs 100-fold!
But, oh! I forgot, it MIGHT decrease the violence among gangs! O.k., then!

zippo
Re: A walk on the wildside. - [info]billdavy1949 - Wednesday, 11 November 2009 at 10:33 am (UTC) Expand
Re: A walk on the wildside. - [info]media_myths - Wednesday, 11 November 2009 at 10:33 am (UTC) Expand
Re: A walk on the wildside. - [info]odubtaig - Wednesday, 11 November 2009 at 12:30 pm (UTC) Expand
Re: A walk on the wildside. - [info]cp01 - Wednesday, 11 November 2009 at 10:42 am (UTC) Expand
Re: A walk on the wildside. - [info]kingofmumu - Wednesday, 11 November 2009 at 04:54 pm (UTC) Expand
Re: A walk on the wildside. - [info]god_realized - Wednesday, 11 November 2009 at 07:34 pm (UTC) Expand
Re: A walk on the wildside. - [info]sergio_montes - Friday, 13 November 2009 at 12:42 am (UTC) Expand
Good article
[info]iunomoneta wrote:
Wednesday, 11 November 2009 at 09:18 am (UTC)
Drug policy should be based on liberty and education not ham fisted authoritarianism, criminalize dealers but not users,the state should not have the right to tell people what to do with their own bodies, people have the right to make their own mistakes.
Re: Here come the druggies
[info]purplefish64 wrote:
Wednesday, 11 November 2009 at 09:22 am (UTC)
Lee Ji Me would be hard pushed,I fear, to find an example of his/her more than spurious theory.Your view is most misguided,I would say,and based on prejudice more than the hard facts of reality-get real.The Dutch have told me they are fed up with foreign junkies,British and all,pouring into their country on drug holidays,because Holland's neighbours won't relax their laws,causing them to want to mistakenly toughen their own laws when the rest should be doing the opposite.So not only are we messing up our own countries ,but other more sensible nations who've got it right.
Re: Here come the druggies
[info]lee_ji_me wrote:
Wednesday, 11 November 2009 at 09:31 am (UTC)
well I'm fed up of Dutch junkies and don't forget the Netherlands is a very very small country where all the drug takers can band together and be controlled more easily - go and live in the Netherlands please
Re: Here come the druggies - [info]laconico - Wednesday, 11 November 2009 at 10:28 am (UTC) Expand
Re: Here come the druggies - [info]lee_ji_me - Wednesday, 11 November 2009 at 06:05 pm (UTC) Expand
Re: Here come the druggies - [info]laconico - Wednesday, 11 November 2009 at 06:38 pm (UTC) Expand
Re: Here come the druggies - [info]lee_ji_me - Wednesday, 11 November 2009 at 06:57 pm (UTC) Expand
Re: Here come the druggies - [info]laconico - Wednesday, 11 November 2009 at 08:31 pm (UTC) Expand
Re: Here come the druggies - [info]lee_ji_me - Wednesday, 11 November 2009 at 09:08 pm (UTC) Expand
Re: Here come the druggies - [info]tonygfd - Wednesday, 11 November 2009 at 09:04 pm (UTC) Expand
Re: Here come the druggies - [info]sergio_montes - Friday, 13 November 2009 at 12:36 am (UTC) Expand
Re: Here come the druggies - [info]lee_ji_me - Friday, 13 November 2009 at 08:08 am (UTC) Expand
Re: Here come the druggies - [info]richard_hode - Wednesday, 11 November 2009 at 10:10 pm (UTC) Expand
Re: Here come the druggies - [info]lee_ji_me - Thursday, 12 November 2009 at 12:18 am (UTC) Expand
Re: Here come the druggies - [info]allentheallen - Wednesday, 11 November 2009 at 03:06 pm (UTC) Expand
Legalisation, a worthy quagmire
[info]halabesa wrote:
Wednesday, 11 November 2009 at 09:23 am (UTC)
This article makes the excellent case for legalising drugs, it is a sensible and rational conclusion; even the Economist has campaigned for legalisation for years.
I have issue with how we would go about it: do we buy product from gangs abroad and continue to sponsor the cut-throat cocaine producers in Colombia, for example? Or do we produce in-house? New industry would help with unemployment, but we hardly have the necessary expertise in the matter. I fear legalisation may only reduce home gangland, while actively, and "legally" patronising it abroad. Not sure what other governments would think of that.
Or you semi-legalise like Portugal, which is sensible enough, but not exactly ringing out with amazing results, consumption goes down a little, but gang monopoly of the drugs market still very much in place.
The problem isn't just legalising consumption and decriminalising addiction, but it is the process of legalising production, shipping and distribution as well. I find it hard to imagine the concerted and coordinated international effort needed to do so.
Re: Legalisation, a worthy quagmire
[info]cp01 wrote:
Wednesday, 11 November 2009 at 11:00 am (UTC)

Homegrown would be the best solution for the UK from a financial and control perspective. If the drugs are grown, processed and distibuted to a chain of UK drugstores - this would create 1000's of new jobs, and allow an audit trail for production, manufacture, and sale of the product for both quality and taxation purposes.

However as you point out the UK does not necessarily have the expertise or climate to produce top quality product.

Ideally drugs should be legalised worldwide. This would take production out of the hands of the cartels, and terrorists, and would give farmers in many 3rd world countries - Columbia, Mexico, Lebanon, Afghanistan etc a legitimate source of income. This policy would result in a large increase in GDP for the countries concerned, which would hopefully bring about a rise in living standards, and decrease in poverty - possibly to the extent that the countries concerned would no longer be 3rd world. A consequence of this would be a reduction in the amount of aid needed by these countries, and in the case of South America it would save the USA the billions of dollars spent on drugs eradication projects etc.
Re: Legalisation, a worthy quagmire - [info]sergio_montes - Friday, 13 November 2009 at 12:39 am (UTC) Expand
The war on drugs
[info]amvet wrote:
Wednesday, 11 November 2009 at 09:24 am (UTC)
Even good countries can be managed into the sewer by stupid governance. In the US, the great scams are the war on drugs, the war on terrorism, and war against information for the voters.
[info]nullius123 wrote:
Wednesday, 11 November 2009 at 09:26 am (UTC)
Plain good sense from JH, as usual.

Unanswerable really.
Where's the naysayers?
[info]chrisclarkgold wrote:
Wednesday, 11 November 2009 at 09:33 am (UTC)
Johann Hari has been going on about this for a while now. Where's all the prohibitionists comments on this thread saying he's just plain wrong, giving their view of facts and figures?

Have they nothing left to say?
[info]alazarin wrote:
Wednesday, 11 November 2009 at 09:34 am (UTC)
Could it be... Could it just be the the reason the USofA pushes it's unwinnable 'War-on-Drugs' in the full knowledge that such a policy fuels organised crime is that the US government has itself been taken over long ago by organised crime syndicates? That would go a long way towards explaining its' strange behaviour in many spheres of the domestic and international arena. A takeover that happened way back during the bad old days of the alcohol prohibition.
Sun/Mail
[info]ourmaninberlin wrote:
Wednesday, 11 November 2009 at 09:53 am (UTC)
Unfortunately it will be very difficult to swing public opinion around on this one because in all likelihood the sun and the mail will campaign against it 'for the sake of the kids'. Even though the statistics will show that several kids are likely to be alive because it has been legalized, that will not be able to compete with the actual dead kid that will have their photo splashed across the front page. Because you know they will do anything to save one kids' life, except doing something that might save a few more.
So the argument is...
[info]fastguyeddie wrote:
Wednesday, 11 November 2009 at 09:59 am (UTC)
We can't beat the criminal gangs so we'll force them to go 'legit by legalisation of drugs thereby freeing the police to tackle other "more serious" crimes (which no doubt will listed daily in media in case they are not sure) of course once free of the scourge of drug enforcement they will have untold success... Not only that but all the drug trafficers and gansters will applaud the "sense" of this policy and either go 'legit or move into tobbacco or alchohol which of course following on from Nutt's advice would be made illeagal in the same bill. I don't know which wardrobe you stepped through somewhere in Islington Hari; but you and I are not sharing the same reality; you seem to be living in a world of rational altruistic sane people who only need someone to reason with them to see sense, I on the other hand live in the real world.
Re: So the argument is...
[info]odubtaig wrote:
Wednesday, 11 November 2009 at 01:06 pm (UTC)
"I on the other hand live in the real world."

Thanks for letting us know, we'd never have guessed otherwise.
Re: So the argument is... - [info]fastguyeddie - Wednesday, 11 November 2009 at 01:14 pm (UTC) Expand
Re: So the argument is... - [info]odubtaig - Wednesday, 11 November 2009 at 02:19 pm (UTC) Expand
Ooh hit a nerve - [info]fastguyeddie - Wednesday, 11 November 2009 at 02:55 pm (UTC) Expand
No, I just despise self-important dumbasses. - [info]odubtaig - Wednesday, 11 November 2009 at 04:02 pm (UTC) Expand
It must be a heart-breaking to catch your reflection then - [info]fastguyeddie - Wednesday, 11 November 2009 at 04:44 pm (UTC) Expand
You're calling me smug and self-important? - [info]odubtaig - Wednesday, 11 November 2009 at 05:38 pm (UTC) Expand
Re: You're calling me smug and self-important? - [info]fastguyeddie - Wednesday, 11 November 2009 at 07:08 pm (UTC) Expand
Re: You're calling me smug and self-important? - [info]odubtaig - Wednesday, 11 November 2009 at 07:26 pm (UTC) Expand
Re: You're calling me smug and self-important? - [info]fastguyeddie - Wednesday, 11 November 2009 at 07:57 pm (UTC) Expand
Re: You're calling me smug and self-important? - [info]odubtaig - Wednesday, 11 November 2009 at 08:57 pm (UTC) Expand
Re: You're calling me smug and self-important? - [info]richard_hode - Wednesday, 11 November 2009 at 10:18 pm (UTC) Expand
Excellent Article
[info]since1964 wrote:
Wednesday, 11 November 2009 at 10:05 am (UTC)
Nothing to argue with here and nothing misguided (lee_ji_me). I am not a drug taker (bar beer, wine, coffee and tea) Would be a great way to save the country money in the recession whilst making the country safer for my rapidly growing kids. Perhaps there would be more cash to spend on schools, universities, hospitals, trains etc... and less need to bomb poppy fields in afganistan - another saving...
A question
[info]tinketytonk wrote:
Wednesday, 11 November 2009 at 10:06 am (UTC)
I've been waiting for JH to wade in on this and delighted to see such a well argued article. But even legalisation causes issues... one of my problems with the Home Secretary's stance is that it so clearly ignores the evidence on the streets. David Nutt is right and it's easy to see. I don't get bothered by drug addicts, the town I live isn't strewn with needles, but I do get regularly stopped by drunk people asking for money, my neighbour is an alcoholic and bottles and cans litter the streets. Are we so used to this environment, that we find it acceptable or like the Home Secretary, don't even see it? I think JH is spot on though - the way to tackle drug use is not simple - we should weigh the evidence and react appropriately. Perhaps the kneejerk answer should be to ban cigarettes and alcohol as they must equally lead to drug abuse as marijuana and ecstasy: but as JH argues, we need to think differently now.
Only made illegal in 1921.
[info]billbeeby52 wrote:
Wednesday, 11 November 2009 at 10:07 am (UTC)
There is good evidence to suggest that drugs were made illegal so that the vested interests of the distilling and brewing families in this country were given an open field to make their vast profits.Many many more deaths are caused by drinking and smoking than all the illegal drugs put together but the government earns vast amounts of tax from them.There is no logic to this policy just prejudice and vested interests as is always the case in our " so-called " democracy.
Good Article
[info]bleedingekk wrote:
Wednesday, 11 November 2009 at 10:09 am (UTC)
Drugs + poverty = crime
crime = a lot of lucrative jobs for the boys

Why on earth would the government want to really control drugs when they are feeding the market which are providing 100's of thousands of AAA rate jobs for the middle classes?
Imagine
[info]auntyeunice wrote:
Wednesday, 11 November 2009 at 10:23 am (UTC)
Liberty is not for the masses and although your arguement may be compelling, to get govt involved will not do away with criminality. How many people smuggle the legal stuff to avoid tax on it. Containers of dodgy cigaretes are discovered in Ireland bound for the ice cream van men all over GB. There is brain damaging hooch sold in markets and passed in pubs all over the place just to make a few bob.
Regular cocane use needs bigger doses to get the same high as it reduces the endorphine receptors, this creates a dependence. Heroin and crack cocaine can be immediately addictive. To much weed can cause paranoia, and until you have had the pleasure of arresting an old friend who beat his wife to a pulp as he thought she was the devil you cannot imagine the horror of what started as a relaxing joint at the end of the day can lead to. Yes we have legal drugs that can be every bit as damaging and drunks who buy their poison legally can be every bit as nasty, but if we all used what there is available in moderation we could probably all do a line now and again or smoke a joint of take a whisky without impinging on our health or others safety, but we won't. You seem to have given up and produce an arguement for your agenda. Just because we have alcohol and cigarettes on our self destruct menu doesn't mean we should go a la carte.
Re: Imagine
[info]odubtaig wrote:
Wednesday, 11 November 2009 at 01:13 pm (UTC)
Would it be an improvement over the current way? Yes.

Do you have a better solution? No.
Re: Imagine - [info]allentheallen - Wednesday, 11 November 2009 at 03:14 pm (UTC) Expand
Re: Imagine - [info]god_realized - Thursday, 12 November 2009 at 12:12 am (UTC) Expand
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