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Police must be 'servants not masters' says head of watchdog

New Met chief could lose support of rank and file if he begins a 'witch hunt'

By Kunal Dutta

Nicole Fisher, from Brighton, is seen remonstrating with a police officer, who slaps her with the across the face before drawing a baton and then striking her on the legs.

Nicole Fisher, from Brighton, is seen remonstrating with a police officer, who slaps her with the across the face before drawing a baton and then striking her on the legs.

Police officers must remember they are "the servants and not the masters" of the people, the head of the police watchdog said yesterday as he condemned the practice of concealing shoulder numbers as "unacceptable".

Nick Hardwick, the chairman of the Independent Police Complaints Commission (IPCC), said he would appear before the Home Affairs Select Committee as the fallout surrounding allegations into the use of police force at the G20 protests grew more acrimonious.

Mr Hardwick said he had "serious concerns" about front-line supervision of officers at this month's demonstrations. The IPCC launched a third investigation yesterday into police tactics after a 23-year-old London man claimed he was assaulted by a Metropolitan Police officer. "Why was that happening? Why did the supervisor not stop them? What does that say about what your state of mind is?" he asked. "You were expecting trouble?"

Mr Hardwick's comments came as former Metropolitan Police Commander John O'Connor warned that the current Met chief, Sir Paul Stephenson, risks losing the support of rank and file officers if the investigation into allegations of abuse became a "witch hunt."

And Sir Ken Jones, the president of the Association of Chief Police Officers (ACPO), moved to defuse the situation by praising the "vast and overwhelming majority" of officers who, he said, deserved public support.

The chairman of the Home Affairs Select Committee, Keith Vaz, said MPs would examine the G20 controversial "kettling" tactic used to contain demonstrators as well as "what happened at the G20 protests" and the scope of the IPCC investigation.

A new video emerged yesterday of two further incidents which occurred at the Climate Camp demonstration in Bishopsgate. The first involved Alex Cinnane, 24, an IT technician from London, who is shown being hit on the head with a riot shield by an unidentified, partially masked officer. The other shows an officer punching an unidentified male demonstrator in the jaw as the crowds retreat from an advancing police line.

By Friday, the IPCC had received more than 185 complaints about the G20 protests, including 90 about the use of force, from witnesses as well as alleged victims.

Mr Hardwick said that the recent trend of digital cameras and mobile phones for photographs and video footage was providing the IPCC with invaluable evidence as well as "challenging" police.

"They have to respond to the fact that they are going to be watched, there is going to be evidence of what they have done," he said. Mr Vaz said that the amount of amateur and CCTV footage meant police actions were "much more open and much more transparent".

Mr Vaz also called for a broader debate about the right to protest and the responsibilities of policing. "It's got to be a democratic question of how do we want to be policed? That needs a proper parliamentary discussion," he said. "The choices we make as a society about that aren't consequence-free. There are tricky balances to be struck."

But temperatures were rising among protesters as some warned that this year's May Day demonstrations could be some of the most dramatic yet. The United Campaign Against Police Violence, a coalition formed in the wake of the G20 protests, met last weekend to discuss plans. "We're trying to stop London on May Day in memory of all those who have died in police custody," said Chris Knight, a founding member. "If police officers haven't got the message at that stage, we may have to take it into our own hands."

Others have called for riot police to wear large football-shirt style numbers on their fronts and backs so that it is harder for them to conceal their identity. A report published by The Camp for Climate Action over the weekend deemed policing as "violent and disproportionate" though not dissimilar to the type of policing experienced at other climate camps.

Incident log: The Met under fire

*1 April 2009

Ian Tomlinson, a newspaper vendor, is struck with a baton and pushed to the ground by a police officer. He is seen remonstrating with the police who offer no assistance leaving it to bystanders to help him back to his feet. Later he dies. Officer is suspended.

*1 April 2009

An unnamed 23-year old man claims he was assaulted by a police cordon in Cornhill. The case, which has not yet come to light on video, is the third under investigation by the IPCC.

n 2 April 2009

Nicole Fisher, from Brighton, is seen remonstrating with a police officer, who slaps her with the across the face before drawing a baton and then striking her on the legs. The officer, whose shoulder number is concealed, is identified and suspended.

*1 April 2009

Alex Cinnane, 24, an IT technician from London, is hit on the head with a riot shield by an unidentified officer whose face is half-hidden by a balaclava. Another video, pictured far right, taken the same day shows an officer delivering a right hook to an unidentified male demonstrator's jaw as the crowds retreat from an advancing police line. Yesterday, a spokesman for the IPCC said that no formal inquiry into these cases had yet begun.

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Time to convene a Common Law Grand Jury
[info]crazations wrote:
Monday, 20 April 2009 at 12:20 am (UTC)
These incidents of the public being abused by their servants have only been exposed because people have ignored one of the government's latest 'Laws' - the newly invented 'crime' of filming a police officer - just one of 3609 Acts of Parliament this government have passed in a effort to stiffle peaceful protest and disent - just look at the lengths they've gone to with Brian Haw & Co. in Parliament Square! - they were the Metropolitan Police's biggest single expense last year - and all because of their message:

Love, Peace, Justice, for All.

These 3609 so-called 'Laws' are not laws at all, they are Statutes - and according to Black's Law Dictionary, a Statute is 'a legislated rule of a society that is given the force of law by the consent of the governed'. Why do you think they are called 'Acts' - because they only act as laws.

I, and many others, have expressly revoked our consent to the government's Statutes by serving Affidavits on The Queen and become a Freeman-on-the-Land in Lawful Rebellion under Article 61 of the Magna Carta of 1215. (see http://www.tpuc.org for more info).

We don't need our public servants to invent new 'crimes' - the UK is a Common Law jurisdiction and it's principles are all we need - do not cause harm or injury to another, do not cause a loss of property and do not use fraud in a contract.

Simple - No Victim - No Crime!

By ratifying the EU Treaty of Lisbon, our public servants have committed the most serious Common Law Criminal Offence - TREASON.

Sounds like it's time for the public to convene a Common Law Grand Jury.

Love, Peace, JUSTICE, for ALL.
Incident log: The Met under fire
[info]skweezleii wrote:
Monday, 20 April 2009 at 12:45 am (UTC)
Quote a few red label titles and make a point?
I'm sorry, but this is The Independent? Right? How about putting some depth on the issues? Just because a pensioner tripped over a flagstone doesn't mean the flagstone spent 25 years planning her murder.
dont argue
[info]britfree wrote:
Monday, 20 April 2009 at 12:47 am (UTC)
even the most trivial encounter with the police can turn swiftly sinister if you attempt to have an alternative/ autonomous view towards what they say , the body language and intonation will change to suggest that you are embarking on a perilous path ,and that they have the arbitrary power to make you regret it
this is all very confusing for people like myself , who lived in the "olden days" (more than twenty years ago) .
Losing support of officers....allegations of abuse
[info]elevengoalposts wrote:
Monday, 20 April 2009 at 01:34 am (UTC)
So the most senior officers might lose support? Total hooey!!
Those abusive police can and should be deselected ASAP. Would they be able to walk away if they are properly investigated and disciplined? No? Why? Because they couldn't get a job anywhere else at the moment.
In any event, the top brass are in charge, not the union mentality of the bovver boy PCs.
Unfortunately, the recruitment and training processes are clearly not up to scratch, so the police service has too many inadequates in their ranks.
Labours Police
[info]johnnynorfolk wrote:
Monday, 20 April 2009 at 05:44 am (UTC)
All the police have done is take the same attitude as the Labour government has taken to the people.

In that the people serve the government not the other way round.
SENIOR OFFICERS SHOULD BE DISCIPLINED
[info]potwalloper wrote:
Monday, 20 April 2009 at 06:34 am (UTC)
The idea that if there is a witch hunt then senior officers will lose support is so farcical as to be almost beyond belief. The actions of rank and file officers on 1 April occurred because of the total incompetence of their managers, both direct line management and at the very top. The strategy taken by the police on that day was determined by senior managers at the Met and it is they who should be held to account as they are the ones who created a situation that could have only one outcome - violence.

What will of course happen is that a few moronic and violent individuals in the front line will become the scapegoats and the idiots who manage them will get away with it yet again, as will the politicians who pull their strings. When there are problems on this scale in any organisation the people who are at fault are invariably the management team and the person who is supposed to provide proper leadership to them, in the case the Chief Constable.

Management at the Met appears to rotten to the core with values such as arrogance, lying to the press, sucking up to politicians and brainless and misdirected PC policies being what are needed to obtain promotion. Principles of accountability, responsibility and public service seem to be completely lacking and many of these senior officers appear to be morally and ethically bankrupt. Junior officers take their cues for what is and is not acceptable from observing their bosses - what a wonderful and inspiring standard their have to aspire to!

There needs to be a witch hunt at a senior level and at a junior level the police should be instructed that if they observe another officer breaking the law they must intervene immediately and if necessary arrest them. Without this public confidence in this bunch of misfits will continue to spiral downwards.

However what will happen in practice is nothing - as usual.
Brutal oppressive regime that uses democracy to step on civil liberties.
[info]djangovsartana wrote:
Monday, 20 April 2009 at 07:13 am (UTC)
The behaviour of the British police is no different to that of a banana republic.
They use exactly the same tactics as the illegal state of Israel that was built on native Palestinian corpses!
ALL
[info]dkayedon wrote:
Monday, 20 April 2009 at 07:26 am (UTC)
Every Publice Servant are employed as such. !!!! Town Hall or police, or other wise.

I am glad this has been brought to our attention. Most of all is the professional side of the work and by the way, Professonialism, is for the public good. Nothing to do with what degee one has. A good doctor is as good as the good road sweeper; both are being PROFESSIONAL
Re: ALL
[info]bassplayer74 wrote:
Monday, 20 April 2009 at 08:21 pm (UTC)
Actually, police officers are NOT employed, they are holders of public office. Individually accountable to the law ... at least that's the theory.

Police apologists
[info]climatewarrior wrote:
Monday, 20 April 2009 at 07:34 am (UTC)
"Mr Vaz also called for a broader debate about the right to protest and the responsibilities of policing."

Is this a different Keith Vaz to the Keith Vaz who has been in the media several times in the last couple of weeks telling us what a good job the police did?

"former Metropolitan Police Commander John O'Connor warned that the current Met chief, Sir Paul Stephenson, risks losing the support of rank and file officers if the investigation into allegations of abuse became a "witch hunt.""

This line has been tried before. When the officers who murdered Harry Stanley faced being held to account in the courts their colleagues took secondary industrial action. In the face of this industrial action and threats of further industrial action the Crown Prosecution Service rapidly dropped the idea of holding the murderers to account.

Giving in to bullies in this way simply encourages them.


The Police did their job.
[info]shepwaykent wrote:
Monday, 20 April 2009 at 07:41 am (UTC)
Nothing more nothing less. On days like the g20 summit the Police are their to defend and protect not to serve. That stupid woman could not read the obvious body language of the Police and got what she deserved as did all the others although no one deserved to die even he knew what he was doing. As a tax payer I paid for that woman to go to London. Did she get 50k for her story? See capitalism does work.
Re: The Police did their job.
[info]drahcir38 wrote:
Monday, 20 April 2009 at 09:12 am (UTC)
You silly person. You didnt pay for the woman to go to London. She had a perfect right to be there to protest about something she believed in, and at least she had the gumption to be active for her beliefs. You say that the police were there to defend and protect. To defend and protect who? The vast majority of protesters (as in 99.999%) were there to peacefully protest, which is what this woman was doing. The newspaper vendor wasn't even there as part of the protest. So did these people deserve to be attacked, and one of them killed, just because the police felt that they had to defend someone or something from them? Are we now living in a time when it is OK just to crush someone as a precaution in case they do something. In that case lets just have a complete curfew from protests, and while we are at it lets just say that people should all be home by 9:00pm just in case they are out for some criminal purpose. God help us if your idea of Britain ever catches on.
Re: The Police did their job.
[info]abs1978 wrote:
Monday, 20 April 2009 at 10:02 am (UTC)
Oh dear, someone needs a reality check.

The freedom to protest is slowly being eroded in this country; people like yourself who make stupid and ill-informed comments in the belief that the "government knows best", only compound the fact that we are sleep walking towards becoming a police state.
Re: The Police did their job.
[info]tobyandtoby wrote:
Monday, 20 April 2009 at 02:29 pm (UTC)
"although no one deserved to die even he knew what he was doing."

What?!!

Yes- he knew exactly what he was trying to do- he was a city newspaper vendor who had finished work and was trying to go home, but kept on getting turned back by the police. Idiot.
Re: The Police did their job.
[info]wag231 wrote:
Monday, 20 April 2009 at 03:10 pm (UTC)
Who were the police defending and who were the police serving? Not the public, that's for sure.
Re: The Police did their job.
[info]bassplayer74 wrote:
Monday, 20 April 2009 at 08:40 pm (UTC)
The police Conflict Management Model is the sanctioned paradigm through which to determine the approach and the appropriateness of the police use of force. It is the model underwhich police personal safety and public order training is configured:

The force used by the officer in question is NOT the only issue to be considered. Also relevant is the person or people against whom the force is to be used and their behavioural presentation ... is it one slight female officer against an aggressive male target with a weapon, or a burly 'rugby' police officer against a child? Is anyone under the influence of drugs or alcohol, etc., etc.. In addition, of MASSIVE relevance is the context within which that force is to be used ... is it a one on one situation in deserted country lane, or is the officer also having to bear in mind the other ongoing police operation around him in relation to hundreds or thousands of people who are animated / aggressive / violent / passive. Next, wherever force gets 'escalated' (ie, greater levels of force are resorted to after lower levels of force failed to achieve the objective), it is of relevant to ask whether other options were tried first and failed, or whether they were rejected as likely to success on good grounds.

Nicky FISHER was subject to verbal instructions with which she failed to comply and a 'push'. She swore at him and advanced toward him again. She was then struck with a hand and advanced again, continuing to swear before the sergeant backed off and drew his baton. He issued a THIRD instruction to back off and she failed to acceed before she was struck. There is an ongoing criminal investigation which will determine an outcome ... it may be the sergeant is prosecuted for assault in order to consider the appropriateness of his tactics.

Within that investigation and trail, however, will be questions for why Ms FISHER failed to adhere to three sets of instructions of back off in what is clearly a tense public order situtation which the police are attempting to manage. A sergeant in the Met TSG will almost certainly have experience of various public order situations in London where crowds which looked exactly like the one with which he was engaged who then caused millions of pounds of damage to property and serious injury to other uninvolved members of the public. Claim that 99.99% of people were engaged in peaceful, lawful protest is no more to the point than it is to outline what a useful 'cover' peaceful demonstrated is against anit-capitalist anarchists. The Met Police were heavily criticised by Londoners in 2000 for failing to manage the threats posed.

If you don't like the policing you have received, which I never have during my five personal engagements with them, each and every person has the option to do what I did and join the police.
Re: The Police did their job.
[info]mike4626 wrote:
Tuesday, 21 April 2009 at 07:12 pm (UTC)
at last, a sensible comment instead of the usual 'rant'
independent
[info]viljam wrote:
Monday, 20 April 2009 at 08:48 am (UTC)
thank god somebody is at last reporting at length and in detail the abuses of this brutal police. For years governments have sucked up to them in the name of the tabloid ideas of law and order. They don't remind me of George Orwell. Rather Antony Burgess' Clockwork Orange.
Police must be 'servants not masters' says head of watchdog
[info]rendevou5 wrote:
Monday, 20 April 2009 at 09:44 am (UTC)
"Police must be 'servants not masters' says head of watchdog":

But we always assumed that they were - until New Labour came along.
Re: Police must be 'servants not masters' says head of watchdog
[info]hiragani wrote:
Monday, 20 April 2009 at 04:35 pm (UTC)
No we didn't, you never lived in Notting Hill in the sixties or were a miner in the eighties. There is nothing new about the police being the controlling arm of the government Dickens also knew that. Protests against the status quo will always get treated roughly. It's not only here either French police a great big thugs too.
Re: Police must be 'servants not masters' says head of watchdog
[info]rendevou5 wrote:
Monday, 20 April 2009 at 06:40 pm (UTC)
Dear Hiragani:

With respect,you don't know whether I experienced the events to which you refer, or not.

But I concede that I only saw them reported - and I take the point you make.

However, I do maintain that in ordinary circumstances, the ordinary police officer at that time was, in general (and probably rightly) considered to be an honest man and a public servant.

Not so now, I think.

Approximately a year ago, a relative came into my house and threw his car keys on the table. He explained that he expected a police car to arrive very shortly.

Apparently, he had stopped at the doctor's surgery to collect a prescription. Dashing in and out as quickly as possible did not prevent him from receiving a parking ticket from a traffic warden who was writing it out as he arrived.

Angered, he threw it on the floor - (a petulent and pointless act, I grant).

His prediction was accurate. Within a couple of minutes, a police car pulled up and two officers came to the door.

One of them stated that the traffic warden had claimed that my relative had thrown the ticket AT him. My relative said that he not; that he had simply thrown the ticket on the floor.

Twice more, the same officer attempted to put words into his mouth, "And when you threw the ticket at the warde....", he said.

Now I knew that if he had done so, it would have constituted assault. So did the officer. My relative did not.

In other words, this offfier, whose duty was to gather information, was really attempting to entrap my relative into admitting to having done what he had not done.

I put my head round the door and pointed out to the policeman that he'd been told three times that the ticket was not thrown at the warden.

"Were you there?" he snapped.

"Were you?" I replied.

"Well," he said; "I believe the warden.

"Well," I said; "you can believe what you like".

The relative of whom I spak has never been in any kind of trouble with the police in his sixty years on this earth. I know, of course, that there have always been corrupt policemen (just as there always has been a degree of corruption to be found among any group of human beings) but I really don't think that twenty years ago, an ordinary member of the public would have been subjected to such a blatant and arrogant attempt to entrap him?
Re: Police must be 'servants not masters' says head of watchdog
[info]hiragani wrote:
Monday, 20 April 2009 at 10:18 pm (UTC)
I wasn't trying to be aggressive in my previous answer, I just presumed that you had seen Dixon of Dock Green, with whom we all would have liked to identify.

However, I got stopped many times on my Lambretta for no other reason than driving it and it was always an aggressive copper who tried to pinch me for something or nothing. Living in Notting Hill in the late sixties meant being stopped by the police and searched for drugs almost every night you were out after closing time. Never were they polite. They just wanted a bust and if they couldn't bust you for a crime, they often bust your lip for good measure. Grosvenor Square....unfortunately I can keep going until the age of about 35, when it all suddenly stopped and I have never been accosted since. Grey hair means you are respectable?

What I am saying, which is reflected in your experience is that, unfortunately, they are in general a bunch of bastards. I remember at school that the ones who weren't that bright and couldn't go to college, or get an apprenticeship, joined the local police force. Enough said, except for Police FORCE, it's in the name isn't it!!
Once again
[info]larkspur_14 wrote:
Monday, 20 April 2009 at 09:45 am (UTC)
the term witch-hunt is mis-used. It is not a witch hunt to prosecute those who break the law. That is justice. Witch-hunts are launched against those not breaking the law, but suspected of it, or of simply not conforming to "respectable" opinions and behaviour. Agents of the state who torture (offered immunity by Obama) and policemen who act like thugs are breaking clearly understood codes of moral behaviour as well as the law. If the rank and file of the force support this bullying behaviour and oppose its suppression, then we are in much worse trouble than we thought.
New Met chief could lose support of rank and file
[info]xyberia44 wrote:
Monday, 20 April 2009 at 10:05 am (UTC)
So what, they already lost the support and the confidence of the public, and in relation to "shepwaykent" comments, it is always good to see the plod hiding behind an anonymous ID and defending the thugs who call them self police.. but luckily "shepwaykent" is a "minority report", with the same mentality as the braindead thugs who perpetrate violence against the public. And unless the constitution of this country has changed overnight, the right to demonstrate is not a crime.

Seems like the National Front Storm Troopers has really made a solid foothold in the police force and nothing short of a witch hunt will uproot this institutionalized racist and thuggish force..I suppose nothing short of a British Nuremburg trial will uproot this evil..
Only human
[info]kitekj wrote:
Monday, 20 April 2009 at 11:04 am (UTC)
What people seem to forget is that the Police are human too. After hours of abuse, stones thrown at them, people spitting at them etc they are going to react. We seem to see a lot of videos at the moment showing the police bashing the protester, but I am yet to see one of the protester bashing the policeman or woman, but of course that doesn't happen does it??.

What appears to have happened to Ian Tomlinson is totally unacceptable and only God knows what was going through the policeman's mind at the time.
Nick Hardwick
[info]sublibellous wrote:
Monday, 20 April 2009 at 11:11 am (UTC)
No doubt Nick Hardwick will now be subjected to a blizzard of police harrassment - constant no-trial fines, being arrested on a technicality so they can get his DNA, or locked up without trial after groundless accusations of being involved in terrorism.
Re: Nick Hardwick
[info]bassplayer74 wrote:
Monday, 20 April 2009 at 08:44 pm (UTC)
How is there NO doubt? How can there possibly be certainty about that .... if you really know you're right about this, please select six numbers between 1 and 49 prior to 6pm on Saturday.
Translation
[info]kuma2000 wrote:
Monday, 20 April 2009 at 11:26 am (UTC)
"Mr Vaz also called for a broader debate about the right to protest and the responsibilities of policing"

What is this crap about right to protest and police brutality? Let's remove the right to protest and let the police do what they want and there is none of this media uproar - they were protesting, they got beat up, that is the law...

Also I thought it was now illegal to photograph the police... Are these whining commies who dare criticize our boys in blue going to be rightfully prosecuted for the scum they are?
Re: Translation
[info]wag231 wrote:
Monday, 20 April 2009 at 03:14 pm (UTC)
These whining commies presumably including numerous Lib Dem, Labour and Tory MPs.

As for photographing the police, I had one officer forcefully request I take his picture at the G20.
Re: Translation
[info]ddraig_ddu wrote:
Monday, 20 April 2009 at 05:52 pm (UTC)

I hope you have a finely polished sense of irony,

otherwise you're just spouting a load of craap
Anomaly?
[info]goosegreece wrote:
Monday, 20 April 2009 at 11:44 am (UTC)
As has been reported elsewhere (but not in the Independent) there was very little outcry or sympathy when the police knocked seven bells out of the protesters for the Countryside Alliance. Seems to be OK. with many people for police violence if they disagree with the cause of the protesters.
Unless you agree with peoples right to protest even if you disagree with the cause then you deserve to lose your freedom. You cannot pick and choose.
Re: Anomaly?
[info]wag231 wrote:
Monday, 20 April 2009 at 03:17 pm (UTC)
If I remember correctly, quite a few of the allegations of police assault on the hunters went to court where none were upheld. So having been tested by the judiciary they were found wanting. Obviously it may be that they were harshly dealt with, but they had their day in court. I would be interested to find out how many of the officers who faced allegations then were also out at the G20.
Re: Anomaly?
[info]goosegreece wrote:
Monday, 20 April 2009 at 04:10 pm (UTC)
Interesting that you referred to these protesters as `hunters`. This was far from true. Try reading the recent article by Hardman in the Daily Mail online. They were treated much more harshly than the G20 protesters (apart from the Tomlinson tragedy).
My point was that the reason for the protest is irrelevant.......we either live in a free and fair society or we do not.
police state
[info]ukcannonfodder wrote:
Monday, 20 April 2009 at 05:25 pm (UTC)
this isn't the first time police have hit peaceful protesters. There are videos all over youtube of police brutality.


Has anyone seen "Taking liberties" (google video)

Or

"On The Verge" about the Brighton EDO protestors where the weapons manufacturer was colluding with the police. The police tried but failed to stop the film ever seeing the light of day. It can be obtained via free bit torrent download from their home page: http://www.schnews.org.uk/schmovies/index-on-the-verge.htm


FTA (above schnews link): In 2004 a group of Brighton peace campaigners began to bang pot and pans outside their local arms manufacturers EDO MBM in disgust of their part in the Iraq war. This has grown into the Smash EDO campaign, which has cost the company millions, been the subject olarge scale police operations and has tested the right to protest in the UK.

Using activist, police and CCTV footage plus interviews with those involved in the campaign, On The Verge tells the story of one of the most persistent and imaginative campaigns to emerge out of the UK's anti-war movement and direct action scene.

The film is already being screened on the Smash EDO Tour which has begun, and dvds will be available to buy in April - with proceeds going to Smash EDO.

Police Repression
Police have attempted to stop On The Verge being screened around the country. The premiere screening at the Duke Of Yorks Cinema in Brighton in March was pulled at the last minute after police invention, and several venues due to host the tour and film have been subjected to police threats - for more see SchNEWS 625, 630.Read 'A misguided piece of official hysteria', the Guardian article published March 27th about police repression against On The Verge click here
Bad guys wear masks.
[info]denmason wrote:
Monday, 20 April 2009 at 08:27 pm (UTC)
If the cops are operating within the law.... why are they hiding themselves with balaclavas? Let us see the face of the cop that assaulted Ian Tomlinson! These officers need to be arrested and face criminal charges... just like any other citizen.
Re: Bad guys wear masks.
[info]bassplayer74 wrote:
Monday, 20 April 2009 at 08:49 pm (UTC)
Police officers are 'hiding' themselves because they are deployed in 'Code 1 Public Order' uniform. This means fireproof overalls, various bodyguards and and faces are covered by 'neckovers', mandatory in that kit.

If you object to this, then the issue is one to raise with Chief Constables, the Home Office and politicians as it is standard UK police practice to do so when officers are deployed in 'Code 1' as part of safety for obvious reasons.
Re: Bad guys wear masks.
[info]jasgeo wrote:
Monday, 20 April 2009 at 09:45 pm (UTC)
Lookit all the little piggies squealing. The reality is that the police don't protect and serve the people, they protect and serve the elites just as scabs and thugs always have.
Those who imagine things were different 20 years ago are living in a dream, the only difference was that less people were desperately on the edge of society, so less people witnessed the police leap to the defence of the ruling class.
No miner, poll tax protester or anti-nuke trade activist of 20 or 30 years ago would notice the slightest difference between what is happening now and what happened then. The middle classes are being put under the hammer in the same way that miners once were is the only change. The police attitude is unchanged.
The right to protest viz. Vote with our feet.
[info]jusoxon wrote:
Monday, 20 April 2009 at 09:41 pm (UTC)
In reply to shepwaykent. I agree wholeheartedly with drahcir38 and your cock-eyed views are laughable. Every citizen has the right of protest. There was no rioting by the public with hands up in submission to say were not here for violence. THE ARMED BATON WEILDING POLICE WERE THE RIOTERS and as the 'law' should work both ways and be applicable to everyone. The Police there,their Managers,and Commanders and right to the top,who organized Operation Glencoe,jointly and severally should be charged under Section Two of the Public Order Act. Inciting a Riot.
Also,mr shepwaykent, Ian Tomlinson had every right try and get home,which is all he asked many times. He did not 'know what he was doing' because he wasn't doing anything. You thicko! He was an ill man as was the 'KETTLED' man trying to give himself an insulin injection in filthy conditions. Lucky he had it with him as well after being kept there for 6 hours. You wouldn't be from Wharf Rd Gravesend would you. Just go away!
Bad Guys don't have id numbers
[info]lkdamo wrote:
Monday, 20 April 2009 at 10:45 pm (UTC)
Well Constable bassplayer74, what have you got to say to that?
Please don't hit me :P
[info]petrovnika wrote:
Monday, 20 April 2009 at 10:55 pm (UTC)
We now live in a stalinist police state, and for those of you who keep saying "if you do nothing wrong then you have nothing to fear", watch your back! because the police are now coming after you.
Witch Hunt
[info]lkdamo wrote:
Monday, 20 April 2009 at 11:47 pm (UTC)
Since when has investigating crimes been a "witch hunt"?

If the TSG want to go on strike in protest because some of thier fellow officers are being investigated for crimes, well fine, sack the lot of them. If they don't understand the job of the police then they are not fit for purpose. Lot's of people are looking for jobs now so it would be easy to replace them.

This little piggy went to jail, this little piggy got to spend more time with his family, this little piggy squelled on his mates, and the rest of the little piggies went on the dole.
And we all lived happily ever after.
If only fairy tales could come true. :D
police
[info]oldplod wrote:
Tuesday, 21 April 2009 at 01:28 pm (UTC)
so as the demonstrators are the masters
if they ask the police to get out the way so they can riot the police have to obey?

UK police are the most restrained of almost all European police forces no tear gas no water cannon etc



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