Troops fighting 'for the future of Britain' warns Miliband
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Independent Minds
After a bloody day of fighting which saw eight British soldiers die in the space of 24 hours, Foreign Secretary David Miliband said today that they were engaged in a battle for "the future of Britain".
He warned that Britain would not be secure until it had built security in Afghanistan.
He said that it was essential to prevent Afghanistan again becoming an "incubator for terrorism" and a launch pad for attacks on the UK and the West.
The Foreign Secretary insisted that ensuring that British troops had the protection they needed was the Government's "highest priority".
However Tory leader David Cameron said that it was a "scandal" that the forces still lacked the helicopters they needed to move around Helmand province.
Yesterday's deaths took the toll for this month so far to 15 and the overall total on operations in Afghanistan since 2001 to 184 - surpassing the 179 who died in Iraq.
Mr Miliband said that it had been a "grievous few days" for the families of those who had been killed, for the Army, and for the whole country.
"We know that they are engaged in a very, very difficult mission and we have a responsibility to engage the country in understanding that mission and supporting it," he told the BBC Radio 4 Today programme.
"This is about the future of Britain because we know that the badlands of Afghanistan and Pakistan - that border area - have been used to launch terrible attacks, not just on the United States, but on Britain as well.
"We know that until we can ensure there is a modicum of stability and security provided by Afghan forces for their own people, we are not going to be able to be secure in our own country."
Also this morning the head of Britain's armed forces insisted that the Taliban was "losing" the fight in Afghanistan.
Chief of Defence Staff Sir Jock Stirrup sent his condolences to the bereaved families, but said it was important to "remember why our people are fighting in Afghanistan and what they are achieving through their sacrifice and their courage".
In a televised statement, he went on: "It's tough going because the Taliban have rightly identified Helmand as their vital ground. If they lose there then they lose everywhere and they are throwing everything they have into it.
"But they are losing and our commanders on the ground are very clear of that. But it's going to take time and alas it does involve casualties, but when it's complete there will be the opportunity for considerably greater governance for the people of Helmand."
The top US commander in the Middle East has warned of tough months ahead in the fight against the Taliban.
General David Petraeus, head of the US Central Command, described the battle in the south of the country as "the longest campaign".
Meanwhile, a former head of the Armed Forces yesterday accused the Government of putting UK forces at risk and spending the "minimum they could get away with" on defence.
General Lord Guthrie, chief of the defence staff from 1997 to 2001, said commanders on the ground were struggling with too few troops.
He told the Daily Mail: "I spoke to an officer the other day who said that the Treasury had affected the operational safety of our soldiers, by preventing an uplift in our numbers."
It is "very likely" that fewer soldiers would have been killed by roadside bombs in Afghanistan if ministers had provided funding for more helicopters, he added.
Prime Minister Gordon Brown acknowledged it was a "very hard summer" for the troops but insisted the Government's resolution to seeing through the mission was "undiminished".
Speaking from the G8 Summit at L'Aquila in Italy, he said: "Our resolution to complete the work that we have started in Afghanistan and Pakistan is undiminished.
"We knew from the start that defeating the insurgency in Helmand would be a hard and dangerous job but it is vital."
The worst single loss of life in Afghanistan came in September 2006 when 14 people died in a Nimrod plane crash.
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Comments
Any of yours in the forces - eh?
But this 'incubator' nonsense is par for the course for a government that earlier this year warned of an Easter bombing spectacular to be carried out in Britain by radical students who had gained entry via Pakistan on student visas.
Terrorism has never been beaten by subjugating the country that harboured or trained terrorists. It only results in precious lives being lost to no purpose. But I suppose when no government minister has kith and kin serving in the forces, and other mothers' sons are paying the price, such a price is considered worth paying.
Don't be fooled by the 'security industry' propaganda.
How can journalists at the Independent simply print this without appending any factual rebuttal??? At the very least, perhaps somebody could ask Mr Miliband to provide a list of Afghani-based attacks against 'the UK and the West'...
Perhaps he could also be asked why this 'war' is taking longer than WWII? Isn't it rather an occupation, that, like the GWOT, goes on as long as Western powers deem fit.
Anybody thinking of joining HM Armed Forces should bear this in mind.
@Indy: Almost nobody I know believes a word of this shit so please cut the propaganda and start giving us some real and impartial news. You obviously have no idea what the thinking public actually believe. This is just getting increasingly ridiculus as time passes.
Let's face it, we're NOT all going to die. Evidence? Well I was born in the 70s and Russia didn't nuke me like the media claimed it would. I've survived AIDS, Ebola, chicken flu, salmonella (hey Edwina love,haven't forgotten you), SARS, Saddam's WMDs ("45 MINS FROM LAUNCH!", the papers told us), global warming, global cooling, peak oil, a couple of recessions, a depression (ongoing, there's hope I might die yet), naughty Arabs, meteor strikes, cancer, etc ad nauseam. I even survived last week's heat wave.
AM I HARD OR WHAT?
Or is this all just bullshit designed to sell papers and make a profit?
However, that ghastly creep Milliband is probably as great a danger to this country in general, and its armed forces in particular, as Bin Laden.
Eh? What catastrophic absence of any historical perspective can possibly cause a Foreign Secretary (for gawd's sake?) to utter such garbage? Packaging up an invasion of another nation as something like 1940.
Disgraceful. No - disgusting. Resign immediately, go and read a few books relevent to your previous portfolio, then say sorry. Then piss off and don't come back.
A lot of Bush's colleagues were involved in the ownership/operation of these defense companies.
They have been kicked out of politics. Labour has a little more to go - so its in their interest to keep up the charade...
this is nothing tot do with security of uk - usa , only the corporations .
let me explain ,
The money, the profits (very good profits).
Your taxes financing these wars are all helping the obsene profits of the following companies and these are just a few of them. GE Aviation, General Dynamics, ITT, Lockheed Martin, The Boeing Company, L-3 Communications, Northrup Grumman, Oracle, Raytheon, Sikorsky, Stonebridge International, BGR Holdings, The Cohen Group, Tri Polis, EP Team, The Fremont Group, and DRS Technologies. 100% profit minimum just for a bullet.
By the time you have got a soldier his equipment and all the logistics to get him and keep him in Afganistan to shoot the bullet into a baby, hundreds of private companies have made a massive profit, all paid for by your taxes.
The Drugs money is all run by the cia, always has been, just ask our buddies in colombia
The muhajadeeen wre set up by the cia to get rid of the russians. The connections are still there.
Divide & conquer, is classic tactic, Create massive disorder which weakens the controlling government. Works all the time. The are using it in Pakistan and to some effect in Iran, Looks like they are trying to split China with their cajoling of the ethnic states within china.
The usa - uk controlling financiers have for the last 100 yrs controlled the mid east, africa, south/central america, far east asia and india and nothing has changed, except the usa has become the largest supporter of non elected governments and puppet 'electeted' governments globally. The usa has continuously interferred in governments around the world and has actually on lots of occasions removed elected governments to be replaced with their own chosen dictators that they have supported until death or if they were naughty eg saddam. Saddam was put into power to weaken Iran. How long was the iran-iraq war? 7yrs or something and the above companies all made alot of money.
Money and profits!
Toolan
This war cannot be won.
Not much more to say...
Toolan
Britain's future is not at risk from the Taleban. The 'Official' story is 9/11 were Saudis and 7/7 were Brits. If our home security is so solid, which it should be after all the liberties the politicians have stolen from us, how are a bunch of Afghan tribesmen going to threaten this little island. They can't exactly ride through the bloody tunnel on camels waiving their AK-47's can they.
Milliband, you are a liar. Have a good look in the mirror and understand you are an inexperienced little boy. You have been carefully positioned so that every time this government hits a bump you nod your head. Through your ignorance thousands of humans are dying.
The only threat to this country is your ego, and the egos of those around you.
You tried that in 1930 and the tribalist deposed the Governor.
These wars have been run before, I say concentrate on what you can
control, i.e, this country.
I don'tlike miliband dressing up a british problem that is really an " internationalist problem "
either. Don't trust this man, he should NEVER be a P.M in this country.
There's a game going on here, eventually the public will get it.
Or is the future of Britian not worth that to you?
The other option of course is the one, I believe to true and that is, you are talking total and utter nonsense.
Listening to you Mr Miliband really makes me want to sware out loud!
Behind thoes boyish looks, hides the mind of an even younger child with no grasp of the world we live in.
So I supose that makes you perfect for the foreign minister.
He fails to mention that this will alienate more British Muslims - perhaps he wants another London bombing to bring in even more draconian anti-terrorism laws.
With Miliband and New Labour - dissent is not an option - they are trying to make out you are against the safety of UK if you call for withdrawal.
The British public will not ask the question - why is it the UK that is in big danger - and not the rest of Europe for example.
It is New Labour that caused the retaliation - from supporting America in helping Israel to kill and subjugate the Palestinians - to invading Afghanistan (when we wouldn't have released Bin Laden) and making up lies about legality and intelligence to invade Iraq.
The troops should be recalled now. The government must be held to account for failed foreign policies that contribute to Islamic resentment now. The people must wake up and become aware now. Or, we consign our fate to the small elite who is essential operating from a base of insanity.
However I am unclear what Britain's objectives are and why we are fighting there?
I have serious reserves concerning the justifications given for the war and for British involvement - they are mostly bland platitudes with little content. I am personally convinced that we were lied to on a number of occasions to justify attacking Iraq which was more about US self-interest with possible crumbs for the UK, and little has changed for the Afghanistan engagement which has not been explained not justified other than as providing unconditional support for our closest allies, the US, then led by the honorable Bush and Cheney.
I do not believe, and nothing has convinced me that this war will make Britain safer; on the contrary I think it is endangering Britain by creating more enemies of people who are potential friends and allies. No reasonable long-term objective has been given other than continued US occupation - Karzai notwithstanding. Where is Britain's interest in the war? To be loved by some Americans...? As a contemporary cartoon said of the breakaway Rhodesian government, Kith my *rse!
There are may ways of containing and fighting a subversive enemy other than formal war against a guerilla enemy in Afghanistan and remote-controlled secret attacks in Pakistan with high civilian casualties which only alienate more people in Pakistan. War of itself is an option amongst others.
I am convinced that, for the present, Obama has no political choice but to pursue the war - the same situation occurred during the Vietnam War where it took the prospect of continued, unacceptable losses and considerable political courage for the US to withdraw. The lead-up to and pursuit of the Vietnam War itself was also fraught with political and military lies.
The time is long past for the government to present clear, realistic objectives, state what Britain has to gain freom this war, and show how the UK resources available will enable us to attain a peaceful coexistence in Central Asia.
It's just a sop to say it's about the security of our country.
Big Oil was ready to put a pipeline through the country with the agreement of the Taliban,
but when they wanted more out of it. Contruction stopped and a change of tactics insued,
i.e it' not about OIL , it's about terrorism.
When big oil have the goverment they want, as in Iraq, then the pipeline will be built and long term contracts signed to generate billions for the oil companys
1.The terrain is very mountainous,the enemy can hide very easily and know the terrain more than UK troops.
2.The Taliban will just retreat into Pakistan and other border countries.
3.The Taliban use guerrila tactics,snipers etc.
It is naive to think you can win Miliband,it just shows how inexperienced he is in his role as Foreign Secretary.God help us if he becomes PM.
If the people became aware that the UK was dragged into an unnecessary war by telling lies in the House; where did the accountability go? Of course, now we also know, that our Mps were busy claiming their lucrative allowances and turning the other way when the important things came up. We should have sacked them there and then. Presently, we are punishing them for their greed , but we have never asked them; how and why they fell for the Tony Blair's lies. Of course, someone yet to answer for the unnecessary loss of lives and livelihoods in Iraq and also for the loss of our soldiers lives.
Afghanistan is not any different to what and how we did it in Iraq.
Regards,
Tizab
Those soldiers fighting are brave and deserve our respect.
But, as far as I am aware, the Teleban had no plans to invade the UK. In fact they were not even terrorists but the government of the country. True they would not hand over those accused of a terrible crime, but then the west does not have extradition arrangements wih every country (e.g. many S. American countries are refusing to return convicted criminals to the UK - so Tleban not the first).
The Taleban might not have been the most enlightened government but all governments have their faailings and not being adequately enlightened is hardly an excuse for us to invade.
you mr milliband and all the other warmongers, especialy blair, have the blood of all these young soldiers on your hands. tell the people the truth you lying ROTHSCHILD puppets!
One last rant, why are the senior officers of the Armed forces collaborating in this fiasco? Many retired senior officers have voiced their opposition, but the senior serving officer corp are quite happy to see their troops sent to do Washington's bidding by sycophants in westminster only worried about their own political hide. Stand up to them, make Britain proud, show Britain that the Officers actually are better than the politicians they serve.
When will this government realize that it simply no longer has the trust of of a very substantial swathe - probably now a majority - of its own citizens, and that the trust isn't there because the government itself has squandered it by "new-speak", double-talk, spin, arrogance, condescension and outright mendacity? It's been caught out again and again and again. It's wiped out the fund of goodwill and optimism that that was there for it back in 1997.
But I suppose, knowing the inevitability of defeat, it'll stagger on to the bitter end. The sad thing is that the price of that will be paid over the next few months in the lives of young members of the armed forces, and in the anguish of their families and friends, not by those who send them, or by their own families. Those who by this time next year will surely be ex-ministers will no doubtl move on to directorships, seats in the Lords, or lucrative jobs in national or international quangos, while their children share their privileges, rather than a grave in some public cemetery in one of the less advantaged corners of the UK.
http://www.ericmargolis.com/political_c
Slouching towards balkanization
http://www.atimes.com/atimes/South_
Personally, I don't buy into either camp. In a recession this deep, recovery doesn't depend on investors. It depends on consumers who, after all, are 70 percent of the U.S. economy. And this time consumers got really whacked. Until consumers start spending again, you can forget any recovery, V or U shaped.
Are green shoots emerging? Not until people feel more secure economically.
US President Barack Obama praises Britain's 'extraordinary' contribution towards the Nato effort in Afghanistan.
I thank you
Firozali A. Mulla
Guess and guess again loose motions???
U.S. Treasury Secretary Timothy Geithner said it was too soon to decide whether the U.S. economy needed the help of a second-round of government stimulus to recover from recession. Cheney Is Linked to C.I.A. Concealment of Terror Program The Central Intelligence Agency withheld information about a secret counterterrorism program from Congress for eight years on direct orders from former Vice President Dick Cheney, the agency's director, Leon E. Panetta, has told the Senate and House intelligence committees, two people with direct knowledge of the matter said Saturday.
US President Barack Obama praises Britain's 'extraordinary' contribution towards the NATO effort in Afghanistan.
I thank you
Firozali A. Mulla
Dead young british men most certainly does require a meaningful answer to many of the questions posed by our presence in this country.
We have been in Afghanistan on and off, for the last 150 years.
We also conspired with the USA (especially during the Carter/Reagan years to fund the Taliban (simply means students)
in order to drive out the Russians.
The Taliban don't really understand why the colour of the uniform has changed as they still regard anyone who is not from that country as their enemy.
How many dead bodies are we going to end up with before we call it a day ?
We know each death will weigh heavily on upon popular people ,but not upon our labour government, as they no longer see popular people as their electors.