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The riddle of Flight AF447

As bodies of crash victims are recovered from the south Atlantic, John Lichfield examines what we know – and may never know – about the fate of the Air France jet

Ten days after flight AF447 vanished over the south Atlantic, the mystery of what happened to the Air France Airbus and the 228 people on board is starting to become clear. Perhaps. All the indications are that the calamity was influenced – if not entirely caused – by a malfunction of the three tiny tubes in the nose of the plane which measured its speed.

Air France voiced its concerns to Airbus months ago about the reliability in icy conditions of the model of speed sensors, or "Pitot tubes", fitted to the A330-200 which crashed 400 miles north-east of Brazil.

The French national airline, after reassurances from Airbus, started in April an unhurried programme to replace the tubes with an improved version. Air France, under pressure from its own pilots, yesterday ordered that at least two of the three Pitot tubes on all its 34 remaining A330 and A340 aircraft should be upgraded immediately.

On Monday, one of the smaller Air France pilots' unions told its members to refuse to take the controls of any Airbus A330 or A340 which had not had its speed sensors changed.

But how can the malfunction of something so simple and basic as a speed sensor explain how a hyper-modern aircraft, only four years old and packed with sophisticated control and communication equipment, could fall from the sky without broadcasting a mayday message?

The aircraft issued 24 automatic, emergency signals in the space of a few minutes in the early hours of Monday 1 June, indicating the collapse, one by one, of most of its electrical and computer systems. Can that cascade of mechanical disasters all be traced to a problem with speed sensors?

Initially, the aircraft was said to have flown into a severe storm and to have "probably" been crippled by a lightning strike. At the weekend, the French meteorological office said that the weather on the night of 31 May and 1 June, while turbulent, was fairly normal for the south Atlantic.

The Brazilian authorities added to the confusion early last week by announcing that they had found debris from the missing aircraft, and a large slick of aviation fuel. The location of this wreckage was nearer to the Brazilian coast, and further south, than the last known position of the Airbus had suggested the crash site would be. Had the aircraft tried to turn back to Brazil? If so why had it broadcast no mayday message? The presence of the aviation fuel also appeared to rule out the possibility of a mid-air explosion and, therefore, of a terrorist attack.

The shamefaced Brazilian authorities admitted on Friday that they had spoken too soon. The wreckage and oil they had found came from unknown ships, not from the Airbus. Within a day, genuine pieces of Airbus wreckage – and by yesterday 24 bodies and part of the tailplane – had been recovered to the north-east, along the plane's scheduled flight path toward Senegal and onward to Charles de Gaulle airport in Paris.

French investigators now say that terrorism has not been ruled out, and was never ruled out, but "all the indications" remain that the Airbus suffered some kind of catastrophic equipment failure.

Airline disasters are meat and drink to conspiracy theorists. Several alternative explanations still exist for the Concorde disaster in Paris in 2000 and the terrorist bombing of a Pan Am jumbo over Lockerbie in 1988. The confusion and misinformation surrounding Flight AF447 will inevitably lead to similarly fevered speculation.

French investigation sources said yesterday that such confusion was difficult to avoid. "You have a three-way muddle here," one official said. "There is the understandable desire of the media and public for a rapid explanation and the unfortunate fact that most of this aircraft has vanished into deep ocean. On top of that, there are extremely complex, technical questions involved which are difficult for even experts to grasp fully."

A French nuclear submarine, the Emeraude, and a naval vessel containing robot submarines should reach the crash site within the next two days. Investigators hope that the electronic equipment aboard the nuclear submarine will allow it to pick up the radio signals from beacons attached to the aircraft's black boxes, or flight recorders, which could be up to 15,000 feet below the surface. Without the records contained in those boxes, it might be impossible to be certain about what happened to Flight AF447.

For the time being, attention is on the aircraft's speed sensors.

In November last year, Air France issued a warning note to its pilots about a "significant number of incidents" and "anomalies" with the functioning of the Pitot tubes, or speed detection devices, on A330 and A340 aircraft. The tubes, fitted in or behind the nose, measure dynamic air pressure against the fuselage and indicate the speed to the human pilot and co-pilot but also, crucially to the automatic, computerised "fly-by-wire" systems which take over the piloting of modern aircraft.

The previous "incidents" on Air France Airbus craft, starting in May last year, suggested an earlier model of Pitot tubes fitted to some planes could seriously malfunction in icy conditions. The problems included wrong, or fluctuating, indications of speed; the automatic switching off of the automatic pilot and even a false warning that a plane was about to fall from the sky. In the early hours of 1 June, when Flight AF447 was 400 miles out into the Atlantic, one of the first of the 24 automatic distress messages that it broadcast to Air France headquarters indicated that the speed of the aircraft was fluctuating wildly. Soon after, the computerised "fly-by-wire" system was switched off – possibly automatically, possibly because the pilots were wrestling to save the plane. At that point its fate and that of its passengers seem to have been rapidly sealed.

Still, French investigators say that they are not fully convinced that the speed sensor problem is the main explanation for the disaster. The jigsaw puzzle is incomplete, they say.

However, senior French pilots point out that the correct speed is crucial to any aircraft's capacity to fly, especially in turbulent conditions. "Speed is a fundamental value for piloting a plane," said Patrick Magisson, a member of the technical committee of the main French pilots' union, SNPL. "It is speed which makes an aircraft fly. It is speed which determines its aerodynamic balance."

In other words, the wrong speed – either too slow or too fast – can be calamitous. If false speed readings are proven to be the cause of the Atlantic crash, both Air France and Airbus will have awkward questions to answer.

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No idea at all
[info]davidmichaelson wrote:
Tuesday, 9 June 2009 at 11:15 pm (UTC)
In other words no one has the slightest clue what caused the disaster!

The reliance on a computer to fly an aircraft will eventually be found to be the reason. One only has to consider the recent accident in Australia where someone programmed the wrong weight into the computer resulting in the aircraft not being able to take off safely and competently almost causing a crash.

If the Airbus relies so heavily on the Pitot tubes for reading the air speed and if the air speed is so critical to the aircraft's safety how was it ever given a safety certificate to fly when the pitot tube is known to be affected dirt debris ice etc? (I expect that a computer somewhere said it was OK.)
Re: No idea at all
[info]2barrows wrote:
Wednesday, 10 June 2009 at 12:18 am (UTC)

I think you'll find that all aircraft rely on pitot tubes to measure airspeed, whether or not the aircraft is fly-by-wire or uses computers. They are very simple pressure instruments, in common use for 100 years, normally very reliable and accurate, and they are heated to prevent icing. However, they can ice up and here is an account at http://aviation-safety.net/database/record.php?id=19971010-0 of a DC9 12 years ago which was believed to have iced-up pitot tubes, and then the slats were deployed at a speed in excess of their design limit because the pitot tubes apparently falsely indicated that the aircraft was going slower than it really was, so the control surfaces were damaged, precipitating a rapid and uncontrolled descent with the euphemistic result "damaged beyond repair". We should wait for the eventual Air Accident report.
Re: No idea at all
[info]salimma wrote:
Wednesday, 10 June 2009 at 01:20 am (UTC)
Indeed; if the problem is with the pitot tubes, then this does not automatically suggest a problem with the fly-by-wire avionics. Though one could certainly imagine a cascade failure triggered by incorrect sensor readings..

The bizarre thing is that most icing-related incidents occur around take-off and landing -- when the plane is travelling near stall speed, and has critical pieces (landing gears and flaps) extended, that are prone to damage at higher speeds. If the plane is flying in a storm, surely the pilot can play it safe and fly at high trust.
Comment
[info]dinolote wrote:
Wednesday, 10 June 2009 at 12:37 am (UTC)
Pitot tubes are just lines of pipe similar to the ones found in fish tank air systems. Usually a pitot head which measure static air pressure ( which changes at altitiude) and dynamic pressure (air entering during fwd flight) using a simple calculation pitot pressure is gained and this is a fundamental criteria in ALL modern aircraft. If the pitot/static tubes were to freeze and therefore alter the x sectional measurement of the tube then this would affect the reading gained at the air data computer, fuel computer etc which would inturn affect how the aircraft compensated for the error. Before we start speculating and blaming the fly by wire age perhaps we should shut up first and understand that those same readings would be present at the pilots/co pilots instruments. What I am trying to say is that unless you know what you are talking about try not to blame the techology that allows these aircraft to fly automatically in conditions a human being would have problems with. I have 13 years experience working with these systems in a military environment and to be honest the journalist reporting doesn't seem to fully understand the whole concept. No offence.
If Speed Makes the Aircraft Fly...
[info]frequentflyer53 wrote:
Wednesday, 10 June 2009 at 12:52 am (UTC)
If speed makes the aircraft fly, would a trained pilot/captain notice that at a lower speed the aircraft would be losing altitude or at least be flying and handling in a different manner, regardless of what the sensors are telling him/her? Almost like noticing when driving your car in a higher gear..

Also if there is a sudden blast of turbulence or wind are the jet engines powerful enough to quickly increase power and stabilize the plane? Considering such a big plane must be flying at quite a speed just to stay in the air, even if its going slower than optimal speed it must still be moving well over the speed of winds and airstreams at that altitude, so I wonder how great the turbulence or crosswind must be to make it lose complete aerodynamic balance as is suggested. Judging by how hard so many presumed ex-airforce pilots land commercial airliners, it seems that these big planes can be handled quite roughly without losing control. The leaf in the the wind analogy does`nt fit the impression I have of these transcontinental heavyweights.

Re: If Speed Makes the Aircraft Fly...
[info]dinolote wrote:
Wednesday, 10 June 2009 at 01:18 am (UTC)
Ok I see your point but what you are missing is the computers onboard modern aircraft are designed to take out alot of the natural occuring errors that are induced into a normal flight. Errors such as side winds, turbulence, air pressure changes. A modern day pilot has so much more going on in the cockpit that if he were to have to compensate constantly for all these errors he would not be realistically be able to fly to his destination without being under considerable stress. Avionics systems are there to allieve him/her of these minor/constant errors/differences. We use alot of feedback loops to achieve this stability. Say for instance you are travelling along the motorway with a sidewind acting on you.....it takes it's toll on you especially if you add rain. You need to be focused on the traffic in front and the road but if it all gets too much you can pull over. A pilot doesn't have that choice so we introduce methods of making his job easier allowing him to concentrate on flying to his destination. I think we have to wait for the accident report before we start jumping to conclusions but these automated systems are the reason air travel is far safer than a motorway journey.
Re: If Speed Makes the Aircraft Fly...
[info]ostrakodermo wrote:
Friday, 19 June 2009 at 11:55 am (UTC)
Well problem with turbulence is not aerodynamic balance... problem is that , if you penetrate a field of turbulence at excesive speed, you are likely to overstress the aircraft structure and eventually go beyond mechanical limitis and have the vesel damaged.
Regarding pitots and fly by wire... as somebody pointed upthere, yes, wrong speed reading will affect actually most of the system, but the critical thing here is the fly-by-wire... why: well, modern comercial aircraft fly pretty close to the Transonic Regime (0.82 Mach) this is to say... if you push the pedal a bit more, you'll get in to supersonic regime... ofcourse, comercial Aircraft are not designed for supersonic... if they dare to venture themselves in to the vecinity of Mach1 (speed of sound) they lose control. flight stability is lost (handled by fly by wire) and the A/C goes in to what is called the high speed stall... the aircraft begins an accelerated free fall which not necessary ends up on the ground (or sea) but with the airframe braking in to bits due to high speed. All this horrific things are prevented by the fly by wire system, by having the right air speed inputs.
Why don't black boxes float?
[info]xqp wrote:
Wednesday, 10 June 2009 at 01:04 am (UTC)
Given the number of miles flown over sea, how come these things don't float?
Re: Why don't black boxes float?
[info]salimma wrote:
Wednesday, 10 June 2009 at 01:17 am (UTC)
There are good reasons [amazon.com] for it
Re: Why don't black boxes float?
[info]dinolote wrote:
Wednesday, 10 June 2009 at 01:19 am (UTC)
....because they are attached to the aircraft as a means to locating the wreckage.
choice of probably causes
[info]sorrilyinterest wrote:
Wednesday, 10 June 2009 at 01:51 am (UTC)
although there are many possibilities in all probability this terrible tragedy was the result of a combination of factors either known to exist or likely to have existed at the time

first was the weather and the decision of the crew to penetrate a line of severe storm cells - this could have been the result of misleading weather radar data or the failure of the crew to properly analyse the display or simply the fact that the storm was developing and changing too fast for the crew to keep up...

second was the potential failure of the pitot system to provide reliable speed data to the autopilot, which has been well documented, such failures have been cited in numerous incidents and the inability to measure airspeed makes it impossible for the autopilot to keep the aircraft flying in severe turbulence and also makes it extremely difficult for the crew to recover the aircraft once control is lost...

third is the design of the Airbus family which takes much of the decision making control away from pilots and relies on a set of complex systems to manage the flight - this has the potential effect of delaying the crew's awareness of a critical and deteriorating situation until it becomes too late to correct...

finally is the potential structural weakness of the A300 and A330 vertical stabiliser (tail fin) which has been a factor in a previous fatal crash...the fact that the stabiliser was found largely intact suggest a catastrophic and sudden in-flight break-up due to a structural overload the onset of which was likely due to the above cited contributing causes...if the stabiliser is determined to have separated from the aircraft at the beginning of structural failure, this may be a fundamental design flaw in this family of aircraft...

obviously this is all speculation until the flight data and cockpit voice recorders are recovered...however I would say that there is enough information to warrant a serious look at all these issues concerning the vulnerability of all modern aircraft when cruising through severe weather...

caveat: I am not a pilot nor an engineer but I have long experience in the aerospace industry and an interest in flight safety...
Re: choice of probably causes
[info]postcomment wrote:
Wednesday, 10 June 2009 at 11:35 am (UTC)
If what you say about the Airbus family and the A330 specifically is true, then how do you explain that this is the first A330 crash in around 500 aircrafts in service X several daily flights = more than 1.5 million A330 flights since its introduction? And how do you explain that Airbus aircrafts don't crash more than Boeing aircrafts in statistics? There have been many, many Boeing 737 crashes for example in the past 20 years that were caused by simple pilot errors that Airbus avionics would have prevented - so on balance a lot of your arguments seem totally flawed...
Re: choice of probably causes
[info]sorrilyinterest wrote:
Thursday, 11 June 2009 at 12:38 am (UTC)
I appreciate part of your argument - however I was not talking about relative risks but the possible limitations and potential weaknesses of the Airbus fly-by-wire control system and construction.

It is because flying is so safe that every individual incident becomes a significant test case for the entire system: crew, aircraft, company policy and support systems such as meteorology.

So, let's not let a rush to defend the manufacturer get in the way of our search for the whole truth. I don't want my family to be exposed to any preventable cause and I'm sure you feel the same way.
Airbus fly by wire is a flawed flight system
[info]drjansurferman wrote:
Wednesday, 10 June 2009 at 02:13 am (UTC)
Both this Airbus and the one that ditched in the Hudson river, suffered the type of failure related to cascading computer flight control systems. Airbus relies too heavily on artificial intelligence in its computer systems, rather than pilot intelligence. The airbus that ditched in the hudson lost its second engine, only because the computer system on the plane, read a sensor that said fire, in the engine, and shut it down without Pilot decision, even though it could have run another 20 minutes and gotten the aircraft to an airport.
External recordings
[info]toroviolet wrote:
Wednesday, 10 June 2009 at 02:42 am (UTC)
Since all spy satellites are listening all kinds of communications and relaying all of them, why not record CVR and
FDR externally as well to avoid situations like these? (smartest reader!)...
Warnings
[info]tadbfm wrote:
Wednesday, 10 June 2009 at 04:44 am (UTC)
I appreciate that Air France sent out advisories and warnings about pitot tubes in the months leading up to this tragedy,but it also received a bomb threat,by all accounts,a week before.If warnings about pitot tubes had gone unheeded for a period of months beforehand without problem,and then a bomb threat precedes this loss by a week,wouldn`t that point to a different conclusion at this point in the investigation.I would also like to know how a part of the tail section of the plane can be found in deep water but not the flight data recorders.
Truth
[info]stickytruth2 wrote:
Wednesday, 10 June 2009 at 05:52 am (UTC)
The mystery of these conspiracies flights, the answer maybe in house?
re warnings
[info]shergar999 wrote:
Wednesday, 10 June 2009 at 07:30 am (UTC)
The tail section (actually just the vertical stabiliser and rudder) are made of materials lighter than water and they were found floating on the surface.The CVR/FDR are attached to the structurally strongest parts of the aircraft, as the vast majority of events where recovery of the data will aid subsequent investigations take place on land. So unfortunately they go down with the ship. Mention has also been made of the pilots not being able to "notice" that airspeed was decaying.In fact , in those conditions the difference between stall approach speed and a speed likely to induce structural damage may only be about 80 knots and when you have just had an autopilot disconnect and the ECAM display is throwing up alsorts of alerts and it is dark and noisy outside and the aircraft is bouncing around the sky-well, nuff said.
AF447 Airbus 330 Control Systems
[info]alexweir1949 wrote:
Wednesday, 10 June 2009 at 07:45 am (UTC)
AF447 Airbus 330 Control Systems

There seems to have been no second system apart from the Pitot Tube to establish airspeed. Despite the fact that Airbus must use GPS to establish position. Thus there has been a gigantic failure of system architecture that the highly computerised facilities of the plane were not used to combine position with time to calculate airspeed net of wind conditions. Even now it is not too late to issue a new software version which will do precisely that. And high-level personnel should also examine which other potential future Elephants are lurking in Airbus's Cupboard.

Mr Alex Weir, ex-Rolls-Royce Aero Engines, Harare, Zimbabwe
Re: AF447 Airbus 330 Control Systems
[info]postcomment wrote:
Wednesday, 10 June 2009 at 11:38 am (UTC)
Ex-RollsRoyce Aero Engines, really? So you should know that GPS is not an option to measure airspeed!! It's only valid for on the ground speed measurement.
re:AF447 Airbus 330 Control Systems
[info]shergar999 wrote:
Wednesday, 10 June 2009 at 08:43 am (UTC)
In order to calculate airspeed using GPS it would be necessary to input wind speed around the aircraft at all times.There is no way to do this even in still air never mind in the ever-changing conditions near to a storm cell. But then there is no need to do this as the Pitot static and dynamic ports do this already - accurately too. However , if they are not designed or installed correctly they are prone to icing/water ingress. This is where the work still needs to be done. It is not specifically an Airbus problem as other types have been lost or severely compromised by the problem.
What happened to the Boeing altimeters?
[info]findempire wrote:
Wednesday, 10 June 2009 at 10:16 am (UTC)
Well the pilots told Air France to change the pitot tubes and it didn't, probably because like most airlines it's broke. A Turkish jet crashed at Schipol in March because Boeing's altimeters were dicky, why haven't we heard any more about that?

Dutch investigators determine cause of Turkish airlines crash


Dutch investigators say a technical failure caused the crash of a Turkish airlines flight last month at Amsterdam's Schiphol airport. Investigators found that a faulty altimeter caused the plane's autopilot to shut down the engines as it made its approach to land. The Boeing 737-800 crashed a kilometre short of the runway, killing nine people on board. The plane's black box showed that the altimeter also malfunctioned during two previous landings. The Dutch Safety Authority says it has issued a warning to Boeing as a result of its investigation.

Anyone know the safety record of Boeings vs Airbuses? No? Why not? Why does them media feast on air crash stories but invariably fail to give us the most important piece of information about them: Air safety statistics? Ever wonder why they aren't published and updated after each crash? Could it be because it would make the Yanks' plane maker look like Tupolev?

Fatal Event Rates for Selected Airliner Models


Fatal Event Rate Per Million Flights
Model		Events
Airbus A300**	9
Airbus A310**	7
Airbus 
A320/319/321	8
Airbus A330	1
Boeing 727**	48
Boeing 737
(all models)	67
Boeing 747	28
Boeing 757**	7
Boeing 767	6
Re: What happened to the Boeing altimeters?
[info]jinglebunny wrote:
Wednesday, 10 June 2009 at 11:04 am (UTC)
findempire

Your statistics are selective and somewhat misleading.

Readers should look at http://www.airsafe.com/events/models/rate_mod.htm and make up their own minds.

Note that many of the figures given are ESTIMATES, whilst others are way out of date.

Flying a huge aircraft at high altitude in clear calm weather is a complex enough task. Factor in really lousy weather and dodgy mechanics, and it can quickly become a marginal activity.

To get a vague idea of the level of complexity, for example, see
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Coffin_corner_(aviation)

Fortunately most plane drivers are extremely well qualified and highly experienced -- and, to be honest, they are probably underappreciated and taken for granted.

I'm not one, by the way.

But, the next time you get on a budget flight, just think of the guys up front and meditate on how little they are probably paid to do the job, and give a silent vote of thanks.
Re: What happened to the Boeing altimeters?
[info]jinglebunny wrote:
Wednesday, 10 June 2009 at 11:09 am (UTC)
...and don't forget that the airlines and aircraft manufacturers hate to admit responsibility for anything -- their lawyers, accountants and insurers will do anything at all to avoid it.

Since the AF447 pilots are sadly no longer with us, get ready to read an accident report that follows tradition and lays a good part of the blame for the crash on pilot error.
Re: What happened to the Boeing altimeters?
[info]findempire wrote:
Wednesday, 10 June 2009 at 01:21 pm (UTC)
"Most plane drivers" are called pilots, bunny honey. Don't stick your cute nose in strange places you know nothing about.
Re: What happened to the Boeing altimeters?
[info]jinglebunny wrote:
Wednesday, 10 June 2009 at 03:07 pm (UTC)
Oh, golly gosh, how hugely cutting.

Pilots refer to each others as drivers, as it happens. Go read PPRUNE or one of the other airline professional sites before you post something else that you know nowt about.

If that's all you can come up with to criticise my post, that's pretty foolish. Apart from your ugly sexist claptrap, of course, which the moderators should ban from this web site. I'm actually a rather muscular bloke who isn't impressed that a troll thinks that my nose is cute.

Selective quotation of estimated statistics in support of your argument is otherwise known as lying. OK, I was trying to be overly polite. I only wished to demonstrate that what you write can't be trusted.
Re: What happened to the Boeing altimeters?
[info]sorrilyinterest wrote:
Thursday, 11 June 2009 at 02:17 am (UTC)

posting simple statistics is an asinine obfuscation of the real issue - we first need to isolate the causes of fatal accidents to make any comparison between aircraft

since airbuses are much more recent designs than most of the other models it's only logical that they would have a lower loss rate, benefiting both from what was learned from previous designs and also benefiting from a progressive reduction in fatal crashes DUE TO ALL CAUSES

we still need to isolate and correct any current, preventable causes, yes? or, are you arguing against that?
Military practise gone wrong
[info]denbundy36 wrote:
Wednesday, 10 June 2009 at 10:38 am (UTC)
maybe its just that....nice cover up coming up....
AF447 Airbus 330 Control Systems
[info]alexweir1949 wrote:
Wednesday, 10 June 2009 at 12:20 pm (UTC)
AF447 Airbus 330 Control Systems

Calculations and algorithms correlating Groundspeed (from GPS), Airspeed (from Pitot Sensors), instantaneous Fuel Consumption (from instruments), and Altitude changes (again from GPS and/or sensors) should be able to indicate whether or not the Pitot Sensors are accurate, and possibly they could provide an airspeed recalibration estimate which might at least get the plane back to base or to its destination without crashing.

Such a mini-system or system patch could be described as a Heath Robinson measure but it might alert pilots and ground control to the existence and/or development of problems and it might also save lives.

Mr Alex Weir (ex-Rolls Royce Aero Engines), Mechanical Engineer and Software Developer, Harare, Zimbabwe


Re: AF447 Airbus 330 Control Systems
[info]nablat wrote:
Thursday, 11 June 2009 at 02:05 am (UTC)
You are solving the wrong problem, I fear. The relative speed of *aircraft and surrounding air* is the critical number, this determines if the plane will stall (or go too fast for its airframe - see coffin corner link above). What you suggested may tell you the speed relative to a fixed location (satellites-earth) but that is fairly useless apart from telling you your ETA, the local/envelope airspeed is the critical thing in any aerodynamically lifted object and one which may vary +-100mph in moments when flying though turbulence (which is not always visible to radar I might add).
How could it be weather if planes fly above clouds?
[info]alimabrouk wrote:
Wednesday, 10 June 2009 at 12:33 pm (UTC)
Is there bad weather above the clouds?
Re: How could it be weather if planes fly above clouds?
[info]shergar999 wrote:
Wednesday, 10 June 2009 at 03:04 pm (UTC)
Who said they do?
Re: How could it be weather if planes fly above clouds?
[info]alimabrouk wrote:
Thursday, 11 June 2009 at 08:26 am (UTC)
They usually do.
GPS
[info]freedommonger wrote:
Wednesday, 10 June 2009 at 06:27 pm (UTC)
As a cruise missile knows its location incl height within a metre or so using the global GPS system and as I can buy a civilian one for a few hundred qwuid that is 10m accurate why dont aircraft have GPS secondary speed monitoring capability then at least they would know ground speed or wouldnt this have helped? In general, is the pitot tube the only technology for measurring air speed? It seems odd if its so crucial to rely on only one tech.

Also, why doesnt the black box data get streamed up in real time via a sattelite phone to the airlines control centre? Sort of like F1 cars have their telemetry constantly monitored.

Neither of these ideas seem very expensive.

Oh, and while I write, why not two black boxes, one that is ejected before impact and floats, one that stays with the wreckage and sinks?
[info]tap_code wrote:
Thursday, 11 June 2009 at 11:35 am (UTC)
What I find so strange is that their was no pan pan pan or mayday warning received from the Aircraft;whatever happened happened very quickly indeed.

Until the flight recorders are found we can only speculate.


The shamefaced Brazilian authorities
[info]tominlondon wrote:
Thursday, 11 June 2009 at 01:31 pm (UTC)
How do you know they were "shamefaced"? Did you see their faces?

This article is presented as a summary of what's known, but is nothing more than completely unfounded speculation.

At the moment nobody knows whether or not the pitot heads had anything to do with it.

At the moment, nobody actually knows anything.
planes need a better black box system
[info]nyc863 wrote:
Tuesday, 16 June 2009 at 12:15 am (UTC)
Since you can buy an inexpensive device that can transmit a data stream continuously to the internet via a constellation of satellites or geo-stationary satellite anywhere on earth (think sat phone), it seems sensible that black boxes start to transmit their vital data in real time, at least the highlights, so this ridiculous endless search for the all-important black box becomes a thing of the past.

If there isn't capacity then spend a bit of money devoted to some arcane military satellite to allow this. Even a 56kbit data stream would be far more info than required to piece together almost any accident and very quickly as well. Even CVRs could be compressed and sent up as well.

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